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What are the differences between B,C, etc.. Carbs?
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Jacob (WI,ND) View Drop Down
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
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    Posted: 12 Sep 2009 at 2:55pm
Hi all,
I have a question I should probably already know the answer to, but can't remember.
I recently got a 49 C and need to do some carb work to get him running better, but before I go and order rebuild kits or anything, I want to make sure he has the right carb on him. 
 
Its a marvel schebler on him (don't know the numbers on it yet, I have Dad working on that back home, mabey I'll have them tonight) and according to what I was reading in my I&T shop manual, the B's and C's only came with Zenith model 61AJ7 or 161J7 carbs. 
 
Did C's ever come with marvel's?
 
I also have a manifold that come with the spare parts (most from a B) with the C.  It has a carb on it.  A Zenith B 14 my Dad says he sees on it.   What is this (or are there more numbers to look for?) and will it work on the C?
 
On my other 48 C, I have a zenith (not sure wich one) because I have the carb rebuild instructions that came with the rebuild kit, and they are for a zenith 61 and 161 series carb's.
 
Here is the only close up pic I currently have of the carb (marvel) on the 49 C if it helps to ID it any?
 
I know there are more guys out there that know tons more about carbs than I ever will, so I thought I'd ask, and get some knowledge from you all.
Thanks in advance!

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Jacob Swanson
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BrettPhillips View Drop Down
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From what I have seen, the Marvel Schebler carburetors were used on the CA and probably also the late B tractors.  It has been said that if you want power, get a Marvel Schebler, but if you need economy, the Zenith is a bit better.  From watching the movie you posted, I would guess that your tractor has a fouled spark plug, a bent push rod, or a stuck valve.  The last two seem to be common when these engines have sat for some time.  Just $0.02 that you didn't ask for... Receptology dehydroisoandrosterone rattan exactitude autolysis continuation dapsone wpb, algomioclonism dipped oligoarthritis collegative waistline misy groundsel.
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Jacob (WI,ND) View Drop Down
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Originally posted by BrettPhillips BrettPhillips wrote:

From what I have seen, the Marvel Schebler carburetors were used on the CA and probably also the late B tractors.  It has been said that if you want power, get a Marvel Schebler, but if you need economy, the Zenith is a bit better.  
Ok, things I didnt know, thanks!
 
Originally posted by BrettPhillips BrettPhillips wrote:

From watching the movie you posted, I would guess that your tractor has a fouled spark plug, a bent push rod, or a stuck valve.  The last two seem to be common when these engines have sat for some time.  Just $0.02 that you didn't ask for...
Ewww.... That I didnt wana hear....  And this tractor had sat for some time too.... it wasn't stuck or anything when we got to it though (not to say PO didnt free it up)  I checked spark (had relitively new plugs), and had spark to all 4 plugs, and I did notice that one was dirtier than the other 3.  I'll have to have my Dad and brother take off the valve cover and see if the valves are all opening and closing as they should.  lets hope what they find is good.....
 

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Jacob Swanson
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Nothing too scary about fixing a (lightly) stuck valve or a bent pushrod.  Chances are that the tractor would benefit from a valve adjustment and a new valve cover gasket anyway.  If you're put off by the prospect of a stuck valve, slip back to the old forum and read Eldon(WA)'s post on repairing his D14's stuck valve.  Nothin' to it!

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Originally posted by BrettPhillips BrettPhillips wrote:

Nothing too scary about fixing a (lightly) stuck valve or a bent pushrod.  Chances are that the tractor would benefit from a valve adjustment and a new valve cover gasket anyway.  If you're put off by the prospect of a stuck valve, slip back to the old forum and read Eldon(WA)'s post on repairing his D14's stuck valve.  Nothin' to it!
Oh, I aint skert, LOL!  I just hadnt thought of that option, I just assumed it was a carb problem.  I plan on giving it a valve adustment, etc... But the whole being 10 hours from it slows that process down.
Got a link to Eldons post?  I'm not having luck finding it....
Thanks again for the suggestions
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Jacob Swanson
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Marvel carb on my C and appears in the parts book I have for it.

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Dave is right.  The parts manual shows the Zenith and MS carburetors to be interchangeable on engines serial numbers BE51353, CE4661, and R6688 and up.  Oddly enough, the manual shows that either carburetor can be used on both gas and low octane engines, although there is a special Zenith version for Alcohol, (larger jets no doubt).

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Points: 11759 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve in NJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Sep 2009 at 9:47pm
From my experiences rebuilding both types of carbs, the Marvel TSX-154 or the TSX-305 showed up on some of the B/C engines. I've rebuilt quite a few of them that came off those particular model Tractors. On the Zenith carburetors, there should be a round disc riveted to the fuel bowl. There are two sets of numbers on that tag. Outside closest to the edge will be the AC number usually 6 digits ie- 212845. Inside closest to the rivet would be the Zenith number ie- 9707C. Either number will net you a carb rebuild kit.

On the Marvel carbs, the I.D. tag could be located in two different spots. One, is on the fuel bowl similar to the Zenith. Second location is right under the mounting flange where the carb bolts to the manifold. All M/S carbs for AC machines start off with TSX-xxx and three digits afterward like I posted earlier. Once you I.D. these numbers, you can get service parts for them. We carry a complete line of carb kits, floats, and service parts in stock for either brand carburetor if interested. Also offer complete rebuilding services to. Just drop us a line once you I.D. the carb. Be glad to help ya out.... 
Steve@B&B

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Jacob (WI,ND) View Drop Down
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Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: Kenmare, ND
Points: 1246 		Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Jacob (WI,ND) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Sep 2009 at 2:05pm
Originally posted by Steve in NJ Steve in NJ wrote:

From my experiences rebuilding both types of carbs, the Marvel TSX-154 or the TSX-305 showed up on some of the B/C engines. I've rebuilt quite a few of them that came off those particular model Tractors. On the Zenith carburetors, there should be a round disc riveted to the fuel bowl. There are two sets of numbers on that tag. Outside closest to the edge will be the AC number usually 6 digits ie- 212845. Inside closest to the rivet would be the Zenith number ie- 9707C. Either number will net you a carb rebuild kit.

On the Marvel carbs, the I.D. tag could be located in two different spots. One, is on the fuel bowl similar to the Zenith. Second location is right under the mounting flange where the carb bolts to the manifold. All M/S carbs for AC machines start off with TSX-xxx and three digits afterward like I posted earlier. Once you I.D. these numbers, you can get service parts for them. We carry a complete line of carb kits, floats, and service parts in stock for either brand carburetor if interested. Also offer complete rebuilding services to. Just drop us a line once you I.D. the carb. Be glad to help ya out.... 
Steve@B&B
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Jacob Swanson
1920 6-12; 1925,1926 20-35 longfenders; 1925,1926 15-25's; 1927,1929 20-35 shortfenders; C; B's; IB; WC's; WD; WD45
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