8000 Series ? for Mark 427435
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Category: Allis Chalmers
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URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=49198
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Topic: 8000 Series ? for Mark 427435
Posted By: dpower
Subject: 8000 Series ? for Mark 427435
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 12:45pm
| Mark since you were in on the development of the 8000 series i was wondering why they decided to put a right hand door on the cab. We have two 8000 series and i never use that door. One of the reasons i dont use it cuz it is hard to get in and out on that side with the console. Also the 7000 series did not have a door on that side. I was just curious i like your insight on this since you were part of developing it. Thanks again |
Replies:
Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 1:11pm
| Yeah but it is handy to access lift levers when coming up that side of tractor when needing to change a cylinder position.I'll keep mine. |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 2:28pm
|
Right or wrong, I drove that. While getting in or out is not easy for a big man, it is certainly possible. It wasn't hard for me to get in or out on the right side back then (5' 11" and 175 lbs). Also, if you had been working on the right side of an implement (or needed to), you didn't have to walk around the tractor. The other reason was to provide access to stuff (tools?) on the floor of the cab and to the console. It also matched the IH cab of the day and gave an advantage when selling against the Deere cab. The real cost wasn't great, either. A couple of hinges, a latch, a little weather stripping, and a little extra steel for the frame. The biggest expense was the extra steps. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: dpower
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 2:41pm
| Thanks for the info mark. I wasnt knocking it, I was just curious on it since 7000 didn't have it. Thanks |
Posted By: Dale
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 2:42pm
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Now that were tapping into a person that can give us a "reason why", here's another that you perhaps can answer. Hope you don't mind.
I have a very early 1977 Allis 8550 and a 1981 8550. On the 1977 front side panels each one is just one piece. However, on the 1981 each front side panel is comprised of 2 sections joined together to form one panel (but you can see the sheet metal joint). When you look in pictures on tractorhouse etc. most times there is the join. Why the change ? Just interested. Thanks
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Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 3:01pm
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I can't help much on the 8550. I worked for Allis from 1966 to 1969 with the Implement Operation, and left for Minneapolis-Moline (White) in 1969 when the La Crosse plant was closed. I didn't want to move to La Porte, Indiana, and I had figured out that the tractor and combine departments got most of the engineering money. When I rejoined Allis in 1977 (White was moving to Chicago----another place I didn't want to live), the 8550 had been in production for a while. My guess that the sheet metal change was probably a cost reduction of some kind. By the way, I hope you have slowed the operating rpm of your 8550's down to the 4W305 setting. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: Dale
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 3:51pm
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I really appreciate you asking that. I would like to do it on all of mine (I actually have 3- one good running so far, one with a rod thru the block but I have found a running take-out 731 to replace it and an early 77 model that needs tranny work)-basically saved the last 2 from the scrapper (i have 3 times the purchase price of each of the last 2 in trucking costs). By the way, with the 731 take-out-any ideas what should I look for before I re-install, in addition to the pump issue.
What exactly needs to be done to get the rpms lower. I know it was talked about on the forum some time ago and I remember I believe it required removing the pump. I would appreciate more detail on what needs to be done. Thanks for asking, Dale
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Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 4:19pm
Find an injection pump shop that has the specs for the 4W-305 pump and have them set your pump to that spec. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Dale wrote:Posted By: Mike Kroupa
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 9:33pm
| Dale, I would also change-out the engine valve rotators, (A-C called them roto coils). CAT has one that is of better design and costs less $. A-C stlye was known to fail and the little pieces of broken spring would get in the oil pump and cause failures. There were many 8550,4W-305's around here 20 years ago and all got changed to the CAT rotators. I have the part number at the shop if u want it. hth, Mike |
Posted By: darrel in ND
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 9:41pm
| 427435, I'm very glad that you pushed the right hand door into production. I don't use it often for getting in and out, but it is very handy to step up and reach in and hit a hyd, 3 pt control, or throttle when doing something on the right side of the tractor. I guess, for that matter, you can pat yourself on the back for just about every aspect of the 8000 series tractors. They're great. Darrel |
Posted By: TREVMAN
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 9:47pm
| I liked the two doors for one reason only, cleaning. I do NOT like to ride around all day in a dirty cab. The 7000 series were a pain to clean out. It is always windy in southern Saskatchewan, open both 8030 doors, head in for lunch, come back, CLEAN CAB. Loved that...Also liked the 7580 door better than the 2 wheel drive, I`m 6`2 and 230 to 260 depending on how much cake I eat, handier for in and out. Trev. |
Posted By: Brad in WA
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 9:58pm
| The right hand door is also very handy for going out of when the metal detector goes off on a pull type chopper.I love it on my 8070's. |
Posted By: Byron WC in SW Wi
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 10:16pm
| Though I don't have an 8000 series tractor I use the right hand door all the time on my tractor to operate hydraulics/PTO, store tools, keep an extra bag of seed when planting and shut the tractor off from the ground after I've let it idle and cool down for awhile. |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 18 Apr 2012 at 10:30pm
Thanks, but it looks like I blew it on the hand throttle location and lack of a foot throttle. My defense on the foot throttle was that none of the main competitors had them either, and I had never had a chance to use one. I did have a chance to use one a couple of years ago in a big New Holland 4WD, but never got used to it. I just used the power shift and shifted down a couple of gears for turns and kept the throttle pretty much on the cruise control. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: MI8050
Date Posted: 19 Apr 2012 at 4:32am
| I like the way my 8050 is set up, I have the throttle in the side console, you guys did good on the 8000's they were ahead of the curve. It was 10 more years before JD copied that setup. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 19 Apr 2012 at 8:13am
|
The only time I use a foot throttle on my 7050, Mark, is the double clutch shift on the road. Which you are not supposed to do anyhow. I don't otherwise use it much cause when going down a rough driveway or in a field the bumps cause me to throttle up and down which makes the ride even rough so I end up throttling up and down even more. I'll tell you when I drive my uncle 8030 I didn't even know it wasn't there. In fact I thought all 8000 series had a foot throttle like the 7000 series. Tells you how much I've missed it on the 8030. BTW I would say that when you blew the throttle position (a longer handle would fix it I think) you guys still did an excellent job and like many have said before you guys put that cab ahead of everyone else. Less plastic would have made it even better.
------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: darrel in ND
Date Posted: 19 Apr 2012 at 8:21am
| 427435, I wouldn't say you blew it on the hand throttle location. My 8050 had the hand throttle on the side of the steering wheel console, and my 8070 has it beside the seat, and I kind of liked it better up front. When you needed to grab the throttle quickly, well you had a 100% chance of getting the right lever. On the side console (maybe I'm just not used to it yet), but i always have to look to make sure I'm getting the right lever. Also, when it comes to cable that are controlling stuff such as throttles, shorter is better. The up front throttle had a very short cable. I noticed on my 8070, the throttle cable goes all of the way out the back of the cab, makes a sharp bend, and then heads up to the pump. Lots of un-neccessary length there. Just my opinion, though. I do love the side console position of the throttle on my one-ninety's, though,but they just seem a little different than the 8070's. Darrel |
Posted By: Unit3
Date Posted: 19 Apr 2012 at 9:47am
| We are having some Trimble GPS units put into the 8070's at a NH store. The man doing the work seems to like the right hand door just fine. |
Posted By: AllisFreak MN
Date Posted: 19 Apr 2012 at 8:38pm
|
427435, were you involved in the development of the 6000 series? If so would love to hear some stories. Maybe I should start a new post for that. ------------- '49 A-C WD, '51 A-C WD, '63 A-C D17 Series III, 1968 A-C One-Seventy, '82 A-C 6060, '75 A-C 7040, A-C #3 sickle mower, 2 A-C 701 wagons, '78 Gleaner M2 |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 19 Apr 2012 at 10:54pm
Yes, I was involved. There was a lot of head scratching (and hair pulling) going on trying to figure out how to replace the very dated 175 and 185. One of the horror stories was an idea someone high in management had of importing Zetor tractors and re-skinning them in Allis sheet metal and color. We brought several over and put them on test. They were a complete disaster. You couldn't run them for a day in the field without something needing to be fixed. Eventually, we settled on a couple of Fiat drivetrains and 4 cylinder Harvey engine. Pretty decent combination. The only big problem was the Harvey engine (and quality control) couldn't handle the thrust load that the dual clutch setup for IPTO put on it. Took a bandaid and a serious field campaign to deal with that. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |
Posted By: AllisFreak MN
Date Posted: 21 Apr 2012 at 10:34am
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Where did the factory cabs come from for the 6000's. Were they made in West Allis or contracted thru another source? They are still a nice cab even by todays standards (lots of glass, modern looking) ------------- '49 A-C WD, '51 A-C WD, '63 A-C D17 Series III, 1968 A-C One-Seventy, '82 A-C 6060, '75 A-C 7040, A-C #3 sickle mower, 2 A-C 701 wagons, '78 Gleaner M2 |
Posted By: 427435
Date Posted: 21 Apr 2012 at 12:19pm
They were designed by ATD (ag tractor division) and produced by a company here in Rochester Mn called Crenlo. They make cabs for a bunch of highway equipment people including CAT, Deere and others. We designed the 6000 Series tractors with a fairly well isolated platform so that a cab could be attached to it with good results. ------------- Mark B10 Allis, 917 Allis, 7116 Simplicity, 7790 Simplicity Diesel, GTH-L Simplicity Ignorance is curable-----stupidity is not. |