AC balers?
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Topic: AC balers?
Posted By: Dave in il
Subject: AC balers?
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 5:35pm
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I'm wondering about AC roto and square balers? How many have one? What price range does each type have. How hard is it to find one in working or at least near working condition? How hard is it to find parts like belts and springs for roto balers and knotter parts and such for square balers. I'm thinking rotobalers are neat but what do you do with the bales after you bale straw from your Allcrop? At least you can sell small square bales pretty easily. ------------- AGCO My Allis Gleaner Company |
Replies:
Posted By: Pat the Plumber CIL
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 6:06pm
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If you plan on selling bales you might as well get a square baler. I personally would not have a problem using the small round bales but people who have not used them in past will not want them. People are familiar with square bales and its hard to convince people that they are just as good. On our dairy farm growing up we had a square baler and later my dad bought an used roto baler.The square bales stacked a little "neater" but other than that I never noticed much of a difference. My dad liked the roto baler because he knew he could fine tune it and it would not break down,unlike the case sq. baler which always broke down at the worst possible times.Being dairy farmers we were always pressed for time because the cows needed milked twice a day.Breakdowns were a bad thing when rain is coming.The roto baler always took a little fine tuning and my dad was a pro at it.Once he got it going I do not remember many breakdowns. We fed cows and put down bedding with small round bales and did not seem that much different.I can remember someone wanting hay,but as soon as they found out they were round they passed. ------------- You only need to know 3 things to be a plumber;Crap rolls down hill,Hot is on the left and Don't bite your fingernails 1964 D-17 SIV 3 Pt.WF,1964 D-15 Ser II 3pt.WF ,1960 D-17 SI NF,1956 WD 45 WF. |
Posted By: ctbowles58
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 6:18pm
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I have a pair of AC bailers a 302 and 303 squair balers i have got some parts from AGCO but dont realy have any trouble with them the parts man told me that knoter parts from NEW-HOLAND were the same. and i found about 30 NOS. pick-up teeth that i have on hand. anyway i have good luck with mine i gave $125.00 for the 303 and $150.00 for the 302 that was about 5 yrs. ago.------ONE OF THEM IS A 1966 AND THE OTHER IS A 1969 BUT I CANT REMEMBER WHICH is which with out looking the only difference in a 302 and303 is the PTO shaft.303 has 3 u-joints and the 302 has 2 ------------- 190XT 2WD45 WF D15 D14 CA BIG10 302 & 303 bailers 77G rake 80R mower 6 plows and alot more |
Posted By: HagerAC
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 7:59pm
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Got a 303 here. Great running machine. Dad worked for the original owner of this baler back in the mid to late 60's and they baled ungodly amounts of hay with it. It is basically worn out, but we still bale about 1000 bales a year with it. Yes NH parts are nearly the same as we rebuilt the knotters in it last winter with a lot of NH parts. The 442, 443, and 444 balers will bring good money if in good shape. ------------- 30+ A-Cs ranging from a 1928 20-35, to a 1984 8070FWA, Gleaner R52 |
Posted By: orange knight
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 8:33pm
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I've got a 444 square baler. Thats the most common type of baler if you are going to use. There was about 1500 to 2000 made. I would value mine at $1500 ------------- Specializing in Allis Chalmers Tractor and Equipment Parts 952-290-1063 |
Posted By: Ryan Renko
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 8:38pm
| I see on yesterdays tractor they have a very clean looking Deutz Allis HD380 small square baler. It looks really nice. Is it a ac painted puke green or who made it??? Ryan |
Posted By: acjwb
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 8:43pm
| I have a 302 and 443 square baler and 2 round balers. Parts are hard to get like special sprockets and items made just for that model. Bearings can be found at auto stores. Knotters are the same as NH. I like using the AC square balers better than the NH 273 that we have. I can bale more hay in a hour with the AC. |
Posted By: HagerAC
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 10:05pm
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I will agree with the above. AC balers seem to have some the highest capacity balers around. I have never been impressed with the green balers myself. Never been around any NH. Original owner of our 303 would bale 350+ bales an hour with it. ------------- 30+ A-Cs ranging from a 1928 20-35, to a 1984 8070FWA, Gleaner R52 |
Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 10:06pm
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So what years were the 302, 303, 443 & 444 built and what are the differences? Is there any reason to look for one over the others? I remember being at an Allis field day where they would only run the Rotobalers about 2 rounds a day because they didn't want to many round bales. Said they were hard to get rid of so they baled most of the straw with square balers. That still doesn't mean I would pass up a rotobaler. What would be a reasonable price for a decent one? ------------- AGCO My Allis Gleaner Company |
Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 10:07pm
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I have baled with a Deutz Allis baler. Fastest baler I ever seen bar none. Never missed a tie either. I wish I had one. Tracy Martin ------------- No greater gift than healthy grandkids! |
Posted By: Rfdeere
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 10:27pm
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Baler Years Built 303 1963-69 302 1966-69
444 1970-75
442 1970-72
443 1972-75 ------------- Randy Freshour,Member Indiana AC Partners, http://www.rumelyallis.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.rumelyallis.com |
Posted By: Ky.Allis
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2012 at 1:07pm
| I have a 444 baler that according to reference books is 1969 model. Back in the early 1990's ,I worked a Ford/NH dealer ,we delivered a new tractor to a lady and this baler was in barn lot with weeds and crap growing out of it. I asked her about it and she said if you load it it's yours. Yes I had to do alot to get it going,but the tin was good and it works like a charm. The knotters are the same as NH,in fact I have one complete NH knotter on it. I believe the 444 was the only AC model that had the pick-up teeth spaced close like the NH super sweep and it does make a difference. I often wonder why AC got out of hay equip. when farming was thriving. Was it because NH was ahead of everyone with better haybines,rakes,balers with more sizes and models of each. And NH had automatic bale wagons- an industry first and still around. Maybe AC figured they were fighting a losing battle with NH and decided to focus on tractors,planters and combines. But just think if the right engineer at AC had the forsight to take the roto baler concept and took it to the next level and the next and the next ect.... WOW wouldn't it have been great to have a AC big round baler???? |
Posted By: Austin(WI)
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2012 at 2:15pm
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I put together some history about the Roto and Square Balers! Check it out! [TUBE]nCGhYqLDr3I&list=PL26449B5D272A6C93&index=7&feature=plpp_video[/TUBE]------------- "Better By Design" |
Posted By: Austin(WI)
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2012 at 2:16pm
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[TUBE]hwsusXM6f94&list=PL26449B5D272A6C93&index=2&feature=plpp_video[/TUBE] ------------- "Better By Design" |
Posted By: Ky.Allis
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2012 at 11:19pm
| Great videos Austin-Thanks for posting them. Maybe it's a good thing AC didn't have a big round baler. If it had been a good baler and AGCO stuck with it,I guess it would be red and say MF on it now. Got to go vomit after typing that. |
Posted By: Clay
Date Posted: 16 Feb 2012 at 9:52am
| Is MF a vulgarity? Sounds like it to me. |
Posted By: earlwcobb
Date Posted: 01 Jul 2012 at 10:30pm
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I have a 444 baler that my Dad bought new in 1972. As you can imagine, it is getting a little worn. It is a wire tie baler. I know that there was a model of the Ford baler that was almost identical for parts. Do you know what the model number of the Ford baler was or where I can get Allis parts for my 444? I desperately need a sprocket for the pickup header. It is the original sprocket, but is rounded off to the point I would engage like it should. I also have an Allis side delivery rake from the 60's and a 7' 80 series Sickle mower that wer bought in 1974. The rake was bought by my grandfather which then he sold to my father in the late 60's early 70's. I live in Muskogee, OK and do not know of any Allis dealers around these parts. ------------- Nothing runs like a Deere, unless its an Allis |
Posted By: n7gleaner
Date Posted: 01 Jul 2012 at 10:36pm
| I have a Allis 303 does not miss a bale can't beat it with a stick. Only thing it will not do is bale corn stalks. |
Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 01 Jul 2012 at 10:50pm
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Earl, the sprocket is probably available from AGCO. If not , I bet a Martin sprocket can be had that will work. It may need a hub welded to it, or might get lucky and buy one off the shelf. Any good machine shop close can fix you up.
My 303 will miss a tie on the LH side occassionally. Not sure what it is causing it. I know it is something simple. Tracy Martin ------------- No greater gift than healthy grandkids! |
Posted By: ky wonder
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 1:58am
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here are a couple that are for sale around here
http://louisville.craigslist.org/grd/2988656342.html" rel="nofollow - http://louisville.craigslist.org/grd/2988656342.html
http://lexington.craigslist.org/grd/3093018443.html" rel="nofollow - http://lexington.craigslist.org/grd/3093018443.html ------------- i like old tractors of all colors |
Posted By: earlwcobb
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 10:36am
| Tracy, I have the same problem with my 444. WHen I crowd it heavy in dry hay or just occasionally it will not twist the wire. One wire is straight and the other is twisted over in a u-shape. Otherwise it bales wonderful, consistent bales. Many of my buyers really like the consistency in the bales. Thanks for the info. |
Posted By: orange knight
Date Posted: 02 Jul 2012 at 10:55am
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I have two white top roto balers that work really good. Also have a 302 and 442. The 442 is forsale. Used all of last year and this year. Works great. Makes good bales. The only thing I liked about the NH was they had a wider pickup head. When I switch over a year ago I also thought that the NH did a better job of picking up hay espicially fine hay since they had there teeth closer together. Although the AC still does a really good job. The AC i thought always made better bales. ------------- Specializing in Allis Chalmers Tractor and Equipment Parts 952-290-1063 |
Posted By: Felicia
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2012 at 5:50pm
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Hello, This is my first attempt to post on a site such as this, but have been trying to solve a problem unsuccessfully. I would like to bale no more than a thousand small square bales each summer. Really all I need and am not as into hauling the stuff as used to be!! I had been watching for a cheap baler as I didn't think it made sense to spend much no more bales than I need. I could just keep buying them. I looked for a long time and anything in my price range was junk. I am not much of a mechanic. I stopped to look at an Allis 303 long side of the rode one afternoon. Was clean, seemed well kept, had been kept in the shed so I asked the elderly gentleman what he wanted for it. He told me $50. I guess he mistook the look of shock on my face and thought I thought he was high cause he quickly said he'd take $35. I paid the man, hooked 'er to the truck and left before he changed his mind. Knew I could at least scrap it and get my money back. I can't get one side to tie. I will tinker and grease and hit it with the hammer and it will tie two or three and then stop. I thought I might just buy the whole knotter ( I only paid $35 so I can spend some on it) but can't find one any where around here. I would need it explained to me as if explaining to a six year old, I'm afraid. Any one out there with lots of knowledge and patience?? Thanks, Felicia |
Posted By: Ted in NE-OH
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2012 at 5:55pm
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There is a sharp blade in the knotter that cuts the twine, be sure it is sharp
------------- CA, WD, C, 3 Bs, 2 Gs, WC, I-400, 914 |
Posted By: Felicia
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2012 at 6:03pm
| Will there be two of those, one for each side?? |
Posted By: Felicia
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2012 at 6:07pm
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I know it is probably just something simple that I don't know how to do keeping me from having a useful baler. And can I just sharpen (if I find them!!) with a file or would I need to use a small hand grinder? |
Posted By: Ted in NE-OH
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2012 at 6:13pm
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Small hand grinder will work.
------------- CA, WD, C, 3 Bs, 2 Gs, WC, I-400, 914 |
Posted By: Bolivar Boy
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2012 at 8:40pm
| Cornbinder Boy was at a sale in Wayne County, Wilmont,Ohio this past weekend where a 302 was being sold along with a D21, 170 etc. a worn out jd 14t went to the Amish for $1.5k. the 302, that looked spectactular, had been housed but probably hadn't tied a bale in 10 years went for $950.00. only 2 guys bid the 302 while 20 Amish hit the jd. |
Posted By: NickT(Ky)
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2012 at 8:47pm
| Dave, there is a later model allis sq baler for sale in Clarkson, Ky. Good looking unit. Can't remember the guys name but can check it out if you like. Nick |
Posted By: soybreedingboy77
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2012 at 10:44pm
| Send me a pm and I may be able to talk you thru your issue |
Posted By: 1946WP
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2012 at 11:13pm
| my first baler was a ac roto baler, used it for years. then I got a NH 67 then a NH 273 and my brother had an AC 303. The ac made a bale that neither NH baler could compare to. I could never make a bale as tight as the AC with the NH. I now have a 302 , 303, & a 444 , but haven't baled with them . they seem to have some tying problems , but haven't taken time to to check them out |
Posted By: Todd AL
Date Posted: 24 Oct 2012 at 12:18pm
| Hey Nick, what model baler is it, and where in Clarkson? |
Posted By: kbfroggy
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2014 at 2:30pm
| I was wondering if anyone out there could help me out. I bought an old Allis Chalmers 303 baler last Fall. The guy had replaced some of what I would call the rings around the pickup bar. When he replaced them he went back with ones that were about 1 1/2" wide and put some of the double "rubber" teeth which I think are Vemeer teeth on the baler. I cut some slats at work to replace the rings he had put on. I went back to the same size as the original ones but the teeth he installed are not wide enough for them to fit properly. I noticed that some of you have posted that NH parts will work on the AC baler but I have not seen anyone actually post model numbers that will interchange with the AC 303. That would be helpful. Can anyone tell me a part # for the correct size teeth or the model # of a New Holland that will work on my baler? From what it looks like the teeth should be a double set somewhere between 3 1/2 - 4" between the tines and no longer than 7" long. I'm just trying to find out what size will fit the best and give the best results. I was looking on bestfarmparts.com but they don't have measurements on all their teeth but they do have which models of New Holland equipment they will fit on those. Any help would be much appreciated. I'm trying to get it put back together before hay season starts. Thanks. |
Posted By: MitchB
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2014 at 7:31pm
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Have you tried looking at the Agco website? They have all kinds of parts online or can at least direct you to a local dealer who should be able to help you out. Guys on this website are always helpful too. Good luck. Mitch & Barb in West MI ------------- Allis Chalmers WD, D14, D17, 190, 6060, 6070, 6080, 8010, I-600, I-615, R62 |
Posted By: ac fleet
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2014 at 9:32pm
| I did have a roto and gave $50. for it perfect working condition! thanks; ac fleet |
Posted By: orangereborn
Date Posted: 28 Jan 2014 at 12:57am
I have several parts balers and should have most any part you need for any 300/400 series square baler and most likely the roto balers too. Thanks...Dale Orangereborn 964 192nd Ave New Richmond, WI 54017 715-247-3079 715-781-2055 mailto:Orangereborn@hotmail.com" rel="nofollow - |
kbfroggy wrote:Posted By: Flint23
Date Posted: 28 Jan 2014 at 1:41am
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you may not need a new knotter, it could be one of the following problems.. 1. too much grease on the knotter. 2. twine tension too tight. 3. twine tension too loose. 4. dull knife 5. bill hook tension too tight. that's just a start, if you don't have a manual you'll want to get one, they are a lot of help. HTH. John ------------- been there done that, not doing it again... |
Posted By: kbfroggy
Date Posted: 28 Jan 2014 at 10:35am
| I did try the AGCO website when I fist got the baler, but I didn't find much help. I may have just not found the right page on it. I went back to it this morning and sent them an email to see if they could help me. I have checked with a few local tractor dealers for New Holland and others but nobody seems to be able to help me without having one of the teeth to compare and I guess all the "old timers" that were around back when have retired or went somewhere else because no one seemed to be able to recollect anything about the AC balers. One dealer told me if I brought in one of the hoops / rings he might have an old other brand that would work on my baler but he is about an hour and half from me and he is not always open on Saturdays. Thanks for your suggestions. |
Posted By: kbfroggy
Date Posted: 28 Jan 2014 at 10:44am
| This is for Orangereborn. Are you a salvage yard? Do you have a website? I am in Texas so you are kind of far from me but if I can't find something local I may send you an email. If you have an old Allis Chalmers 303 bale Chief that has the correct size teeth on it could you possibly tell me what the dimensions of them are (length of the teeth and the distance or spacing between the teeth). I may be able to find them local. If the hoops I made don't work out I may see what you have available later. Thanks. |
Posted By: orangereborn
Date Posted: 28 Jan 2014 at 2:05pm
I can and I should be in Dallas or however far south I need to go to thaw out sometime in Feb....And lets just say it is a sizeable "pumpkin patch." Dale
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Posted By: JohnCO
Date Posted: 29 Jan 2014 at 12:34am
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Something else to check on the non tying knotter is the bile hook return spring may be broken. Happened twice on my Hesston 4600. ------------- "If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer" Allis Express participant |
Posted By: koabd1978
Date Posted: 02 Aug 2017 at 6:56pm
| so which NH baler model knotters for an ac 444? seen a lot of references to them fitting but not what model NH they come from |
Posted By: orangereborn
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2017 at 11:31pm
Try NH# 717011..I think that is still the current #. But it will get you where you need to be. Many small balers take that same bill hook. I just talked to the NH dealer today and I think it is about $100...Saw one on Ebay today @ $77. Let me know if I can help...Dale Orangereborn 964 192nd Ave New Richmond, WI 54017 715-247-3079 cell 715-781-2055 mailto:Orangereborn@hotmail.com" rel="nofollow - - Orangereborn@hotmail.com |
Posted By: DennisA (IL)
Date Posted: 03 Aug 2017 at 11:38pm
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If you need just the bill hook AGCO still has the OEM parts. The number is 70541489. ------------- Thanks & God Bless Dennis |