HD6G starter
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Construction and other equipment
Forum Description: everything else with orange (or yellow) paint
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=196820
Printed Date: 08 May 2024 at 11:54am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: HD6G starter
Posted By: doctorcorey
Subject: HD6G starter
Date Posted: 23 Aug 2023 at 4:12pm
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I need to replace the tired starter on my 6G, converting to key switch type. The ones I see for sale all are the same file photo, with the solenoid positioned such that it would have to be mounted on the bottom, to fit into the bell housing/flywheel boss. I recall my 7G had the solenoid mounted on bottom.....is my memory correct? Aftermarket starters are in the 3-400$ range, and new Delco is 800+ I don't have much faith in the 'local' starter rebuilders, so I'd rather start with a new one. ------------- Semper Fi USMC 1958 HD6G, 1959 MF 203 loader, 1960 Case 420B Backhoe, MF 65 Tractor/Loader Diesel |
Replies:
Posted By: Ian Beale
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2023 at 5:52am
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IIRC a Delco 42 lets you adjust the nose cone to point the solenoid where you need it. No idea on the others
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Posted By: Codger
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2023 at 6:48am
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I'd go with a Delco 39MT myself: https://www.delcoremy.com/starters/find-by-model-family/39mt-gear-reduction-starter" rel="nofollow - https://www.delcoremy.com/starters/find-by-model-family/39mt-gear-reduction-starter ------------- A career built on repairing and improving engineering design deficiencies, shortcomings, and failures over 50 years now. |
Posted By: doctorcorey
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2023 at 10:19am
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Thanks for the info. Any chance anyone knows the specific starter number in this 39 series that fits my 6000 engine HD6G? I'd always prefer a gear reduction starter because they are simply more efficient at converting electricity into rotational movement. Also considerably less expensive. Mine is still positive ground with a working original generator.....any considerations there? ------------- Semper Fi USMC 1958 HD6G, 1959 MF 203 loader, 1960 Case 420B Backhoe, MF 65 Tractor/Loader Diesel |
Posted By: Codger
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2023 at 10:33am
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It will fit a standard SAE mount which your's probably uses. Positive, or negative ground won't make any difference to the starter motor. What is important is the starter drive gear tooth count. Don't put a 10 tooth if the original is nine for instance. ------------- A career built on repairing and improving engineering design deficiencies, shortcomings, and failures over 50 years now. |
Posted By: doctorcorey
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2023 at 11:08am
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This DB starter, 8200330 replacement appears to be the right setup. 39MT, 11 tooth, 24 v, rotatable flange CW rotation. Sound right? ------------- Semper Fi USMC 1958 HD6G, 1959 MF 203 loader, 1960 Case 420B Backhoe, MF 65 Tractor/Loader Diesel |
Posted By: doctorcorey
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2023 at 11:09am
------------- Semper Fi USMC 1958 HD6G, 1959 MF 203 loader, 1960 Case 420B Backhoe, MF 65 Tractor/Loader Diesel |
doctorcorey wrote:Posted By: Codger
Date Posted: 24 Aug 2023 at 12:25pm
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I've used DB Electrical many times in the past. Never a problem with their products. Don't know if the aftermarket offers it but the Delco starter has "soft start" built into it. This eases flywheel ring gear and starter drive teeth wear. I've installed a lot of them and never a problem but they are a bit on the expensive side compared to the aftermarket. Much of Delco manufacturing is in Mexico these days. ------------- A career built on repairing and improving engineering design deficiencies, shortcomings, and failures over 50 years now. |
Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 25 Aug 2023 at 11:18am
| Current HD Truck engine starters, 11T drives, are now gear reduction and use about half the juice to crank as the old 40 or 42MT starters. Also about Half the weight of those old Iron Monsters. |
Posted By: Codger
Date Posted: 25 Aug 2023 at 11:50am
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If yours is a 24VDC system now would be a good time to swap to 12VDC. With the starter you could also get a 10, or 20 SI series alternator and easily convert to 12V and lose one of the starting batteries.
------------- A career built on repairing and improving engineering design deficiencies, shortcomings, and failures over 50 years now. |
Posted By: doctorcorey
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2023 at 8:36am
 ------------- Semper Fi USMC 1958 HD6G, 1959 MF 203 loader, 1960 Case 420B Backhoe, MF 65 Tractor/Loader Diesel |
Posted By: Codger
Date Posted: 26 Aug 2023 at 8:56am
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Nuthin wrong with 24VDC systems at all. With the cost of starting batteries these days many people would rather not replace two if they have the option of only one. I always replace all in a set so no matter to me. ------------- A career built on repairing and improving engineering design deficiencies, shortcomings, and failures over 50 years now. |
Posted By: DieselBumpkin
Date Posted: 29 Aug 2023 at 8:58pm
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I did my own research last year and bought a Delco-Remy 8200330 for my 6000 engine. I am glad to see that someone else came up with the same part number because I have a 6000 engine but no starter or adapter plate for it. I pulled the old starter off the HD344 (it's in bad shape) and took the plate off, looked through a ton of Delco-Remy and other brand products, and made some measurements. I don't remember what site it was that I ordered from as it looks like a company that operates multiple sites. The email and invoice mentioned Engine Parts Superstore, KALBRO, and Gomondial. It came in right at $450 with FedEx ground shipping. Everything looks right, but I haven't turned the engine over yet, so don't take my word for it.
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Posted By: doctorcorey
Date Posted: 30 Aug 2023 at 8:53am
------------- Semper Fi USMC 1958 HD6G, 1959 MF 203 loader, 1960 Case 420B Backhoe, MF 65 Tractor/Loader Diesel |
Posted By: DieselBumpkin
Date Posted: 30 Aug 2023 at 4:20pm
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I took the plate off the HD344 and cleaned it up. Be sure that you use the right length for the three capscrews because if you're half an inch too long, you will hit the flywheel. I bring this up because the flange on the new starter might not be the same thickness as what was on the old starter. I'm going to do the same thing with engagement once I have the wiring straightened out. Having those teeth half-engaged would be bad news.
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Posted By: DieselBumpkin
Date Posted: 30 Aug 2023 at 4:36pm
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Posted By: DieselBumpkin
Date Posted: 30 Aug 2023 at 5:01pm
| So to really answer your question on whether I used the plate, I'm not sure yet. If I did my homework right, I will be reusing it. If I didn't, I'll probably cut a new plate while the engine is on the stand and I have the tools right there to do it. I'm not going to use a stack of washers or turn standoffs because rats love nesting in the bell housing. Ask me how I know that. |
Posted By: DieselBumpkin
Date Posted: 30 Aug 2023 at 5:09pm
I did take a few pictures of the mess that the rats left in the HD344. |
Posted By: doctorcorey
Date Posted: 30 Aug 2023 at 7:46pm
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On second thought, it probably isn't that hard to compare the engagement depth by comparing the old 'iron log' Delco to the new GR starter. About the rats, I had 'em loaded up the steering clutch compartments and their urine is like epoxy. ------------- Semper Fi USMC 1958 HD6G, 1959 MF 203 loader, 1960 Case 420B Backhoe, MF 65 Tractor/Loader Diesel |
Posted By: doctorcorey
Date Posted: 01 Sep 2023 at 9:54pm
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Starter arrived today, and after a bit of head-scratching on it's wiring, I installed it, and it spins the old motor over like a top. It did require a dedicated ground cable to the large lug on the end of the starter, as it appears that these starters are not grounded through the case. It does have the 'soft-start' feature, and yes, I did have to use the factory spacer plate. ------------- Semper Fi USMC 1958 HD6G, 1959 MF 203 loader, 1960 Case 420B Backhoe, MF 65 Tractor/Loader Diesel |
Posted By: DieselBumpkin
Date Posted: 02 Sep 2023 at 11:09am
| It's finally a cool day here today, so I might have to give this a shot myself. |
Posted By: DieselBumpkin
Date Posted: 08 Sep 2023 at 8:53pm
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I installed the starter on the 6000 and used the plate. This starter TURNS the engine with ease. Since I have the engine on a stand, I didn't bother bonding the ground. I made new cables today using the AC parts book and was very pleased to see the lengths listed next to the part numbers. I am going to have to pull the ground strap off the dozer to get the length for that and see what diameter the stud is on the chassis side. I remember the strap being somewhere around 8 inches or a foot long.
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