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8.3 Cummins Gleaner?

Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=176443
Printed Date: 18 Dec 2025 at 8:17am
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com


Topic: 8.3 Cummins Gleaner?
Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Subject: 8.3 Cummins Gleaner?
Date Posted: 02 Dec 2020 at 9:54pm
How many hrs are they good for assuming regular maintenance. Oil changed etc. Do they throw rods,burn pistons,drink oil? What? Anyone ever OH one?



Replies:
Posted By: JPG AUSTRALIA
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 1:04am
I run 2 R62 s with the 8.3,my original one has 8000+ Engine hours and 6300 rotor hours. I had to rebuild the motor at about 7000 hrs because they have an idler gear between the crank gear and oilpump gear and the idler broke and i lost oil pressure. Caught it quickly,but still lost turbo,it locked. Pulled motor down completely and liners where perfect still, so new orings on liners,piston rings and all bearing shells,plus seals gaskets ect. I disassembled the head and all valves and valve guides were all perfect. Very good motor with mid mounted liners ,so no cavitation pits at all on the liners. Dont know why the idler gear failed but otherwise couldnt fault it.


Posted By: Kansas99
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 6:42am
Stay away from the ones with the caps fuel system. Other than that they're good motors.

In fact stay away from any cummins with the caps system.



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"Thank you for your service Joe & the Ho"-----Joseph Stalin


Posted By: randy
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 6:58am
What is a caps fuel system?

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CA WD WD45 D17 D17 Diesel 7060 8050 8070


Posted By: victoryallis
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 7:00am
certainly better reliability than a Duetz 

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8030 and 8050MFWD, 7580, 3 6080's, 160, 7060, 175, heirloom D17, Deere 8760


Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 8:54am
This looks like P pump with aneroid valve period. Seen a caps once and this doesn't look like it. From serial # it's a 97


Posted By: Kansas99
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 9:12am
Caps was only used for a few years, on r65 first few years before sisu motor.  I don't think it was ever on a 62


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"Thank you for your service Joe & the Ho"-----Joseph Stalin


Posted By: MikeKroupa
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 10:16am
I had a 2002 R62 with the Caps Fuel System, also a 2005 R65 with the CAPS. Marginal fuel system as its best. Head gasket coolant leakage to the outside of the engine block is common, pretty easy, straight forward repair. I always used genuine Cummins gaskets and bolts if needed. 8.3 mechanical is a good and reliable engine. 97 R62 will have the longer shoe which it needs. Good Luck, Mike 


Posted By: Amos
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 3:39pm
Know of a few overhauled in trucks, not farm equipment.  Each one was complete overhaul, had been run hot.  Have encountered several in farm equipment with head gasket issue, not a hard fix at all.  

8.3 are good solid engines I think.  Start great, run good, and make solid power.


Posted By: cwhit
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 5:26pm
At one time around here we had 8.3s in the combine,grain truck, and the 4wd New Holland. Combine had a little over 3500 hrs when we traded it off. It’s still going. There’s a lot of trucks with 8.3s with a lot of miles on them. A good solid engine.


Posted By: victoryallis
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 6:27pm
Originally posted by cwhit cwhit wrote:

At one time around here we had 8.3s in the combine,grain truck, and the 4wd New Holland. Combine had a little over 3500 hrs when we traded it off. It’s still going. There’s a lot of trucks with 8.3s with a lot of miles on them. A good solid engine.


Our harvest lineup is all Cummins.... R62, repowered 7580, and truck. All 8.3’s

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8030 and 8050MFWD, 7580, 3 6080's, 160, 7060, 175, heirloom D17, Deere 8760


Posted By: im4racin
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 6:36pm
Nothing wrong with the caps fuel pump. It’s only limited by the people working on it that have no clue how to make it work.


Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 7:55pm
Isn't it that doodad on top of the pump,not the pump itself?


Posted By: im4racin
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 9:28pm
Caps is basically a high pressure pump like common rail but has a distributor instead of a rail and poppet injections. The injection control valve interrupts fuel flow between ports in the distributor. There are 3 basic parts to the pump assy. The pump next to the gear housing with the big block on the top that holds the pumping chambers and “fill valves”. The injection control valve located between the big block and the distributor housing. And the distributor housing hanging on rear of pump housing. The fill valves open to allow fuel into pumping chambers   The time open is related to pressure required. The icv interrupts fuel the pump builds as needed to change timing and stop flow between ports as the distributor rotates. They are really simple but the diagnostic steps are more of a good guess than direct steps. There are parts in the system that aren’t talked about or tested in diagnostic and that is what will cause most people trouble when troubleshooting


Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 03 Dec 2020 at 10:45pm
All in the name of what? Emissions? Economy? Cousin had to have that replaced on his 65. Was over $1500 I think for part alone. Makes no good sense.


Posted By: Kansas99
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2020 at 1:39am
That was probably those porcelain parts in the head fill valves or pumping chamber or whatever that crap is.  They're supposed to be lubed by fuel, did it 3 times on my 65 and then finally spent $5k on a whole new pump and know it throws codes that there is air in the system but everyone throws there hands up now.  My brother had a CaseIH 4wd with a cummins with a caps system, worked on it for years, in a last ditch effort tried to put a mechanical back on the motor but never worked, he sold the tractor on auctiontime. It didn't bring much as everyone already knew about caps.  I once called cummins about my 8.3 and when I told the guy it had a caps he said "UH OH" Ouch They didn't use it long.


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"Thank you for your service Joe & the Ho"-----Joseph Stalin


Posted By: injpumpEd
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2020 at 7:31am
The CAPS was Cummins' answer to the Bosch VP44 used on the 5.9. It looks nothing like a P pump though, except it uses a P pump mounting flange, so that is why there have been shops develop kits to put a Bosch P pump on those engines. I've heard they had other issues though, never been involved with one, no time to get involved lol! The injectors are still a typical injector and look just like ones from a 24 valve 5.9 but taller. I think there's a few injection shops that service those pumps with some success. I'm not one of them lol! I know better than to even mess with one. 

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210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers!


Posted By: Kansas99
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2020 at 7:35am
Ya if you see somebody walking in with one of those lock your doors! LOL


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"Thank you for your service Joe & the Ho"-----Joseph Stalin


Posted By: im4racin
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2020 at 6:13pm
Don’t knock something you don’t understand.


Posted By: Ricky D
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2020 at 6:32pm
8.3's had a front cover leak problem, we had R62 &they fixed that when we got it. We now have R65 w/Sisu, about a third less fuel. Both engines perform well but can't believe the difference in fuel consumption.


Posted By: MikeKroupa
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2020 at 9:26pm
AGCO also used a similar designed injection pump on the SISU tier 2, 8.4L engines. We have one in a tier 2, 240A Tractor. It's been really dependable except for one catastrophic inj. pump failure years ago. It was maybe 5 years old, took it to Diesel Specialties, Sioux City, 1,500 dollars later still running strong. Engine manufactures were trying to catch up with new EPA mandates and use these designs until common rail  technology was developed and became widely adopted. I have vivid memories of waiting for Cummins Central Power Service Tech to show up and diagnose fault codes on my under 200 hours R62. All while our other 1999 R62 8.3CTA continued to hum along. , Mike


Posted By: Kansas99
Date Posted: 05 Dec 2020 at 2:15am
Originally posted by im4racin im4racin wrote:

Don’t knock something you don’t understand.


Well I own one and I can tell you that in 4500hrs.  it has been worked on 3 times by a agco dealer, once by a pump shop, and once by cummins and $8k later it still is not right.  So I will knock them because they're junk imo.


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"Thank you for your service Joe & the Ho"-----Joseph Stalin


Posted By: im4racin
Date Posted: 05 Dec 2020 at 5:18am
Find a better tech


Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 05 Dec 2020 at 10:49am
Originally posted by im4racin im4racin wrote:

Find a better tech
I have an idea. Why don't you offer some help/guidance on the much hated CAPS fuel system instead telling everyone they are "stupid". You must be one of a few who know why they are not a problem. That system has cost alot of people alot of money and still a problem. When "qualified" people can't fix it,there's something out of whack.


Posted By: im4racin
Date Posted: 05 Dec 2020 at 12:26pm
Ok ask the tech working on it where is the transient suppressor. If he can find it and a part number he might have a clue.


Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 05 Dec 2020 at 6:20pm
I like the KISS rule. If it's difficult, not to mention expense, to service then there might be a problem even if it "can" be a good system. Like a Deutz engine.

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Wink
I am a Russian Bot


Posted By: JPG AUSTRALIA
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2020 at 6:34am
Both my engines run the bosch inline pump.only bad thing id say about my 8.3s is that they love to drink fuel. I use alot more fuel at harvest then at seeding time.


Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2020 at 5:45pm
Originally posted by JPG AUSTRALIA JPG AUSTRALIA wrote:

Both my engines run the bosch inline pump.only bad thing id say about my 8.3s is that they love to drink fuel. I use alot more fuel at harvest then at seeding time.
I noticed that my L2 took a good bit less fuel to harvest the same acres as my R52.

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-- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... -
Wink
I am a Russian Bot


Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2020 at 11:10pm
Originally posted by Lonn Lonn wrote:

Originally posted by JPG AUSTRALIA JPG AUSTRALIA wrote:

Both my engines run the bosch inline pump.only bad thing id say about my 8.3s is that they love to drink fuel. I use alot more fuel at harvest then at seeding time.
I noticed that my L2 took a good bit less fuel to harvest the same acres as my R52.
My F2 uses less that 2 gal per acre...an 8.3 R62 would suck compared to that! Oh well.


Posted By: victoryallis
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2020 at 11:27pm
Originally posted by SteveM C/IL SteveM C/IL wrote:

Originally posted by Lonn Lonn wrote:

Originally posted by JPG AUSTRALIA JPG AUSTRALIA wrote:

Both my engines run the bosch inline pump.only bad thing id say about my 8.3s is that they love to drink fuel. I use alot more fuel at harvest then at seeding time.
I noticed that my L2 took a good bit less fuel to harvest the same acres as my R52.

My F2 uses less that 2 gal per acre...an 8.3 R62 would suck compared to that! Oh well.



Hard to beat the 433TI motor on fuel.

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8030 and 8050MFWD, 7580, 3 6080's, 160, 7060, 175, heirloom D17, Deere 8760


Posted By: Dave974
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2020 at 2:15am
Originally posted by victoryallis victoryallis wrote:

Originally posted by SteveM C/IL SteveM C/IL wrote:

Originally posted by Lonn Lonn wrote:

Originally posted by JPG AUSTRALIA JPG AUSTRALIA wrote:

Both my engines run the bosch inline pump.only bad thing id say about my 8.3s is that they love to drink fuel. I use alot more fuel at harvest then at seeding time.
I noticed that my L2 took a good bit less fuel to harvest the same acres as my R52.

My F2 uses less that 2 gal per acre...an 8.3 R62 would suck compared to that! Oh well.



Hard to beat the 433TI motor on fuel.

+1 on the 433TI and fuel economy Thumbs Up 

I recently went from an F3 to an L2 with a 426 and while I love the extra capacity and smooth 426 power, I miss the fuel economy.  Sounds like an 8.3 Cummins would ratchet up from there. 


Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2020 at 7:03pm
True...if you want to dance with the pretty girl,it'll cost you.


Posted By: Amos
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2020 at 9:07pm
Originally posted by Dave974 Dave974 wrote:

Originally posted by victoryallis victoryallis wrote:

Originally posted by SteveM C/IL SteveM C/IL wrote:

Originally posted by Lonn Lonn wrote:

Originally posted by JPG AUSTRALIA JPG AUSTRALIA wrote:

Both my engines run the bosch inline pump.only bad thing id say about my 8.3s is that they love to drink fuel. I use alot more fuel at harvest then at seeding time.
I noticed that my L2 took a good bit less fuel to harvest the same acres as my R52.

My F2 uses less that 2 gal per acre...an 8.3 R62 would suck compared to that! Oh well.



Hard to beat the 433TI motor on fuel.

+1 on the 433TI and fuel economy Thumbs Up 

I recently went from an F3 to an L2 with a 426 and while I love the extra capacity and smooth 426 power, I miss the fuel economy.  Sounds like an 8.3 Cummins would ratchet up from there. 

I find a couple of these posts a little bit off from my experience.  I run a R52 with a Deutz.  If I use more than a gallon per acre, then I must have been in corn that was flat on the ground at less than 1.5 mph.  I normally see about .9 gallon per acre maximum.  If an F2 is using close to 2 gallons per acre there must be something out of wack there, I would think, but I never ran an F2...I do however have a one owner 6060 with over 10,000hrs on it and I can tell you that engine does not use fuel even when you are working it to its knees...I doubt an L2 with a 426 would use more fuel than and 8.3 powered R52, and you will have a bit more capacity with the R52, a R62 will out work that L2 without even breaking a sweat!

One thing I can not grasp is why I see farmers with  big capacity combines like R62 or larger size machines with a 6 row corn head, talk about an inefficient set up.  I never got a good consistent sample from my 52 until I put an 8 row on it, and did some modifications to it.  And if you really want to save fuel, you put a grain buggy under that unload auger.  I went from  no buggy and a 6 row head at 5+ mph to a 8 row at 3.5mph with the  buggy and found my harvest fuel consumption ( including the 305 on the buggy's fuel ) cut itself by 35%.  
The 8.3 is an excellent engine, but the trade off for making power is fuel, the energy has to come from some where, But if you have your combine set up incorrectly, and with the rotary combine this seems more critical, you will be working your engine harder than it needs to be working, using more fuel.  My advice is to spend time with your combine getting to know how to adjust it and try different settings out to see how they affect all aspects of the machine.


Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2020 at 12:08am
So the fuel tank pump is off about 10% (low) from experience years ago. According to read out,I put 92 gal diesel in the F2 to harvest 43.5A beans & 44.5A corn.  92+ 10% is 101. The math says that's 1.15 gal/A. That is less that 2.


Posted By: Amos
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2020 at 6:46am
I misread the previous post, was thinking 2 gal per acre, 
The larger machines are not necessarily any more fuel efficient, but in time efficiency they cover so many more acres than the smaller machines...


Posted By: JohnColo
Date Posted: 08 Dec 2020 at 9:10pm
I think one reason guys run a six row head is that they can drive it from field to field without taking off the head.  That's not much of a problem out west here but I know back east with those little fields between hills and woods that moving to the next field takes more time then the savings with a bigger head.


Posted By: JimIA
Date Posted: 10 Dec 2020 at 12:13pm
This is the first time I have ever heard someone say something good about the CAPS fuel system.  I have dealt with them in some Gleaners and New Holland tractors. I actually know of a few farmers that had Magnums with them that converted the engine over to a mechanical Bosch inline fuel pump.  

We had a recent issue with a late R62 that had the CAPS pump on it.  The engine would turn over but not fire but if you give it a sniff of ether it would fire and run.  Had a Cummins repair shop work on it for the customer.  We ended up replacing every electronic piece on the engine.  When I asked the customer if he had welded on it recently, he said yes and he did not unhook the battery and the problems started after that.  He did not put them together until I asked.  

Fun times.

Jim  


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An open eye is much more observant than an open mouth


Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 10 Dec 2020 at 3:36pm
I bought an anti zap thingy you hook to batter to keep from hurting em. Welding shop uses them all the time with no problems. I have done the same but if welding without one,you better disconnect the ecm from the system however you go about it.



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