I'm just a good ole sucker,,,,,,
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Other Topics
Forum Name: Shops, Barns, Varmints, and Trucks
Forum Description: anything you want to talk about except politics
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=173569
Printed Date: 15 May 2025 at 2:36pm
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Topic: I'm just a good ole sucker,,,,,,
Posted By: desertjoe
Subject: I'm just a good ole sucker,,,,,,
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2020 at 5:43pm
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,,,,,,,for a sob story,,,,,,I just cannot say "No" to a friend in need,,I can't,,,, I was up in the Alien town this mornin deliverin a parts car to a buddy that has a wrecking yard and met an old friend there that has a Hyster fork lift with a bad engine. He had picked up a Ford 6 cylinder engine that he was told would bolt up to the Hyster bell housing and wanted me to check out the Ford engine and get it running to install in the Hyster fork lift,,,,? The Ford is on a skid and has these numbers cast on side of block D7BE,,,6015 - CA . It has a tag --Ford Power Products but the SN, disp nor Model are NOT legible. Anybody ID this engine from this limited info,?? I'm trying to upload some pics of the engine now,,,,,
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Replies:
Posted By: FREEDGUY
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2020 at 6:03pm
 , Why would your "friend" need an engine that he bought "checked out" and get running by you  ?? Yes, I saw where you said "friend" 
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Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2020 at 7:49pm
In order, here is what each digit in a Ford part or casting number represents:DIGIT #1—DECADE OF MANUFACTURE:A - 1940 DIGIT #2—YEAR OF THE DECADE:0 - 1960, 1970, etc. 7 = 1977 Example: B8 = 1958; C1 = 1961; C9 = 1969; D9 = 1979, etc. DIGIT #3—CAR LINE:A = Ford (from 1958; Galaxie, Custom, LTD) DIGIT #4—ENGINEERING OFFICE RESPONSIBLE FOR ORIGINAL DESIGN:A = Light Truck Engineering Division DIGITS #5-9—BASIC PART NUMBER:This series of numerals denote the actual part description, i.e., wheel assembly, relay assembly, etc. It is possible a letter or two may also appear within the series of numerals. The basic part number is still the same, however if the alphabetical letters are disregarded. DIGITS #10-12 (SUFFIX)—DESIGN CHANGE:Normally an alphabetical letter, with the original design being designated by the letter "A". A first revision to the original design would normally be noted with a "B", although sometimes this digit identifies a completely different component, even though the basic part is the same. For instance, different engine displacements and designs. Parts finished in different colors can be identified by their suffix numbers as well. For instance, the Simulated Styled Steel Wheel Covers for a 1969 Ford Thunderbird carry the basic part number C9SZ-1130D, followed by -26B for Brittany Blue color, 13D for Candyapple Red color, etc. ------------- Like them all, but love the "B"s. |
Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2020 at 7:54pm
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encyclopedia--- Minor changes were made from 1973 to 1975. For 1973, the 170 CID engine was dropped, making the 200 CID I6 the standard engine.....no changes for 1976-77. ------------- Like them all, but love the "B"s. |
Posted By: HD6GTOM
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2020 at 9:12pm
| Joe my son has 1 in a skid loader. It has been a real pain in the tookas. He was told it was the same as a car engine. The governor is totally different, starter is different, everything about the distributator is different. He finally found a new starter in an obscure shop in Chicago. He did find a local guy to fix the governor and he found distributor parts in California. Parts for his are almost non existent. I would sure look the situation over before I took it on. Good luck. |
Posted By: desertjoe
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2020 at 10:47pm
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Thanks for that info, Steve,,,,a maverick,,,??? OK,,,some friends come over and brought their 10 year old son,,,and after watchin me strugglin with tryin to transfer pics from IPhone to PC,,,he asks if he can try,,,,,,I'll you for sure,,thet little boy is one day gonna own the cia or be the best scammer in the world,,,,  I'ma give it a whirl with his assistance,,,,,  Yowza,,,,,  Is this for reals,,??  CHIT FIRE,,,that little kid is one valuable little boy How does one tell if it is the 170 or the 200 six cylinder? It has whats left of a governor on right side,,?? Right off the bat,,looks like it needs distributor cap and wires and a starter. It does turn free and has compression,,,, anybody know what bell Housing patterns this may be,,????
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Posted By: LouSWPA
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 1:07am
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looks like an air pump on it. That alone would be enough to scare me away! no carb? no intake manifold. The emission set up on those '70s Fords were a nightmare. Of course, if it is an industrial version, may not have all the emissions stuff, but that would mean diff carb and manifold ------------- I am still confident of this; I will see the goodness of the Lord in the land of the living. Wait for the Lord; be strong and take heart and wait for the Lord. Ps 27 |
Posted By: shameless dude
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 1:18am
| you can see it used to be blue, and was repainted. that is prolly a car engine, other engines that went into machinery/farm equip were industrial engines. had a Haggie high boy sprayer once with a Chrysler slant 6, when i had to get parts (starter) i found out they were different from a vehicle engine, it was an industrial engine. i then learned that most all engines werte leke that...they looked the same, but were very different. looks like your "friend" got "honked"! |
Posted By: Lars(wi)
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 6:54am
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I worked at Heathercrest Farms when I was in high school a few yrs after, they had a Ford skid steer, that everybody there claimed the engine was the same block as what was used in a Pinto. ------------- I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science. |
Posted By: Thad in AR.
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 7:10am
| Joe let me do some digging. Visually a 170 and 200 are the same. That’s what the pics appear to be. |
Posted By: Thad in AR.
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 7:14am
| The 144 170 200 except late ones and 250 had their own unique bolt pattern |
Posted By: Thad in AR.
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 7:25am
| 144 and 170 have 3 freeze plugs visible below the exhaust manifold and 200 and 250 have 5. |
Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 8:51am
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the BLOCK number D7B should be 1970 vintage, 77 actual year, and put in a Maverick... In 1977 i think the 200 was the only 6 cyl engine available for the maverick. If it was for an industrial version, the letter "B" would have been a "J" or other ?? You would think a BLOCK was BLOCK... why a different casting for a car / truck / tractor ?? maybe the distributor hole / etc ??
------------- Like them all, but love the "B"s. |
Posted By: desertjoe
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 9:04am
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Hey Thanks, Thad,,It does have the 5 freeze plugs on right side of block. It does have a belt driven "Pierce Cove" governor so is prolly an industrial engine,,?? What is puzzling me is where did they mount the starter? It must be mounted way down low on the bell housing as there are no bolt holes on the block that I see,,,?? Fact is there is not a "relief" on either side of the block for the starter,,,?
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Posted By: chaskaduo
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 2:06pm
Hand Crank Start Joe.  ------------- 1938 B, 79 Dynamark 11/36 6spd, 95 Weed-Eater 16hp, 2010 Bolens 14hp |
Posted By: JC-WI
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 6:51pm
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Starter was prolly mounted on the bell housing plate adapter. ------------- He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that." |
Posted By: desertjoe
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 7:38pm
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Yeah,,JC,,I figured that but there is NO cut out or "relief" on the block like most others I've seen,,,, And NO!!,, Chask there ain't no crank start,,,,I done looked,,,, Kinda weird there ain't a place for a starter,,tho,,,I cleaned and re checked on the btm of the block back there and there are NO threaded bolt holes on the ears of the block,,,,on either side ,,,so ,,WTH,,??
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Posted By: JC-WI
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 9:28pm
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DJ, your in luck, I can give you a visual... asbra~KaDABRA!.. PRESTO!  Bonus...  Hope this helps. ------------- He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that." |
Posted By: desertjoe
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 9:49pm
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yep,,JC,,that sure looks like what I got. Went back outside and re-looked and the right side of this block has the 3 bolt holes kinda in a verticlal orientation that I'm thinking is what the bell housing bolts to,,?. Looks like what I got to locate is the "plate" that mounts the starter,,can't tell if that is a 2 bolt starter or a 3 bolt starter,,?? Plus a bellhousing, so I can see what else it is going to need to start and run,,,but RUN it will,,!!!! Is there any indication that the engine is an industrial model or maybe just one scrounged out of a mavrick car,,?? The belt driven governor makes me think industrial but,,,,,?? Many Thanks for your help, JC,, I LOVE projects like this but they sure keep me from those I should be working on,,,,,GRRrrrrrrr,,,,
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Posted By: truckerfarmer
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2020 at 10:11pm
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Just a stab in the dark, but, would that be the same engine used in the Versatile swathers? ------------- Looking at the past to see the future. '53 WD, '53 WD45, WD snap coupler field cultivator, #53 plow,'53 HD5B dozer Duct tape.... Can't fix stupidity. But will muffle the sound of it! |
Posted By: desertjoe
Date Posted: 17 Aug 2020 at 7:43pm
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Hey JC,,on closer inspection on the two pics,,one looks to have the starter mounting to be part of the bell housing and the other pic has what looks like a plate that fits between the block and the bell housing,,,???
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Posted By: LouSWPA
Date Posted: 17 Aug 2020 at 7:51pm
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DJ I think it (the starter) definitely mounts on an adapter casting for the bell housing (clutch/Flywheel housing?), 2 bolts. My question is what mounted on top of that casting, and what is the large appendage hanging below the starter mount ------------- I am still confident of this; I will see the goodness of the Lord in the land of the living. Wait for the Lord; be strong and take heart and wait for the Lord. Ps 27 |
Posted By: Thad in AR.
Date Posted: 17 Aug 2020 at 8:28pm
Lots of Fords mount the starter like that. They have a flat plate between the bell housing and BlocK like pictured. The starter bolts to the bell housing. I’ve started many by just bolting the starter to that plate and bolting the plate to the block with short bolts. |
desertjoe wrote:Posted By: desertjoe
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 4:33am
You know,,Thad,,now that you mentioned that,,,,seems like I remember way back when My Son and I were restoring his 65 Mustang with a 289 and an automatic,,(an ALD, I think) it had a Plate that fit between the block and the tranny and the starter bolted to it,,,,I'll have to admit,,the only'ist thing I used to dislike bout them fords is that they had so dang many different bell housing bolt patterns,,,,not like them Chevys,,,all v8s had same bolt pattern to the bell housing,,,,
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Posted By: Steve in NJ
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 8:38am
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There were a lot of differences between the Industrial engines and the Automobile engines. One major factor, especially the Starter mounting which you feller's are discussing. I know a lot of Hysters used the F226 or F227 Continental engines which were one tough engine. We had em' at work. Starters bolted to the Bellhousing adapter also if I remember correctly. And boy could they could pick! I think we still have a couple at other District locations. The one we had at our shop was a 1963 H80C. I swear, that thing could pick a building up! LOL! We had some air compressors and wire pullers equipped with the Ford overhead cam motors, (like Pinto/Mustang II) but again, they were a little different in their accessories. Different intakes & Carburetors due to different linkages used for the applications along with Govenors. Steve@B&B ------------- 39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife |
Posted By: JC-WI
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 10:56am
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Well Joe, looks like your getting onfo to some degree... Truckfarmer, Swathers were one of the applications, think the sprayers were another... and used in wood chippers, generators, etc. ------------- He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that." |
Posted By: desertjoe
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 11:43am
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OK,,I got on a Website,,Ford Power Products.com and according to some of those folks,,what I have is a 1977 Ford 200 out of a Maverick,,,, like ole Steve said earlier. The pics I took of the engine are same as what they posted. The smaller of the inline 6 's have the integrated intake manifold on the cylinder head, which this one has, also the water pump is 3 bolts Vs the larger engines which have 4 bolt water pumps. Somebody must of added the belt driven governor on this engine when they decided to use as an industrial application. Gonna remove the governor and prolly save or sell as it is free turning. What I need now is a bell housing and a starter for that year maverick or granada. I took the flywheel off and am gonna make me a template for the bell housing bolting to start my scrounging in the wrecking yards,,,,anybody got one in their stash,,,???
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Posted By: JC-WI
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 12:25pm
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joe, the block is from a ford maverick, but the yellow is from a different engine bolted on to that block... Head, cover, cleaner, distributor, fan, coil, governor... go check the Hyster bell housing, maybe it already has the plate on it that you need... check location of the starter hole too... maybe get luck and find the flywheel would fit the FM engine? Governor is used for constant stead power, I don't know if the forklift would need that or not. ------------- He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that." |
Posted By: chaskaduo
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 12:28pm
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Ebay $120 shipped  ------------- 1938 B, 79 Dynamark 11/36 6spd, 95 Weed-Eater 16hp, 2010 Bolens 14hp |
Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 2:30pm
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go check the Hyster bell housing, maybe it already has the plate on it that you need... check location of the starter hole too... YEA... in the end if it has to match up to the HYSTER BELL HOUSING, you might as well get it NOW and check out the fit... TOO late later if it wont fit that housing. It may not be just a simple bell housing since it has to have a hydraulic pump drive, transmission drive, and steering pump drive ???
------------- Like them all, but love the "B"s. |
Posted By: desertjoe
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 9:44pm
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Hey JC,,the guy I'm doin the work for told me that this engine is susspossed to bolt up to the Hyster bellhousing,,,,? I was just wanting to get a "something" to mount a starter so I can do whats needed to get this engine running.,,,but you got a dang good idea in that I should go take a real close look and get good measurements on the fork lift assembly first. Hey Chask,,good to see you back,,Pardner ,,,hopin your ailmants are gettin under control,,,, Yeah,Chask,, I had seen that bell housing on ebay but don't think it would fit as the two upper bolt holes appear to be way too close together than this engine,,, You know,,Steve,,I called the dude today and suggested maybe it be cheeper to just take the Hyster engine out and throw a cheep overhaul kit at the Hyster engine and KNOW everything would fit. THing is,,he was told this Ford was in good running shape (when parked) and he already paid for this engine,,,bout 5 months ago,,,,???
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Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2020 at 10:24pm
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well, if you get it running and it dont fit the Hyster, you can always buy a 77 Maverick and GET ER DONE !! ------------- Like them all, but love the "B"s. |
Posted By: Thad in AR.
Date Posted: 19 Aug 2020 at 5:03am
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Joe you can start that motor with just that flat plate. I’ve started many that way. Go to the parts store and see what all 2 bolt starters will bolt up the same. You may then find one easier. I’m using the 300-6 starter on my 351 w. |
Posted By: desertjoe
Date Posted: 19 Aug 2020 at 8:35am
Yeah,,Thad,,that's what I'd really like to do to keep the costs down. I really doubt whatever bell housing I get to match this block is gonna bolt up to the Hyster transmission. I'm gonna go to the parts store this Am see if they have a plate that will bolt to the engine just for mounting the starter,,,,maybe I can float a loan from ole Shameless to buy it,,,,,
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Posted By: chaskaduo
Date Posted: 19 Aug 2020 at 10:32am
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How's about this one if parts store comes up empty. $33 + $18 to ship. https://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-1970-1971-1972-1977-Mustang-Bellhousing-Separator-Block-Plate-157-USA/263854407454?fits=Year%3A1977%7CModel%3AMaverick&epid=2013804747&hash=item3d6ef2bf1e:g:YXkAAOSwpvZaDi8f:sc:FedExHomeDelivery!55436!US!-1" rel="nofollow - https://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-1970-1971-1972-1977-Mustang-Bellhousing-Separator-Block-Plate-157-USA/263854407454?fits=Year%3A1977%7CModel%3AMaverick&epid=2013804747&hash=item3d6ef2bf1e:g:YXkAAOSwpvZaDi8f:sc:FedExHomeDelivery!55436!US!-1  ------------- 1938 B, 79 Dynamark 11/36 6spd, 95 Weed-Eater 16hp, 2010 Bolens 14hp |
Posted By: Ray54
Date Posted: 19 Aug 2020 at 1:52pm
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Back at the beginning of this ......, adventure I was thinking Joe ant that big a sucker. But buying pieces just to start this little mechanical wonder...............,maybe O'l Joe can be suckered. When the deep pockets guy thinks this just needs a few bolts moved around,O'l Joe may have to shenanigan Deep Pockets into paying for extras. I am guessing that the fork truck is still moving so you cannot just get the old bell housing to see for 100% that things fit? Since your in this far I guess you can tell him he needs a new starter for a new engine. As good as you are Joe,
to fix all this junk with other free junk I need to get you working all my treasures. |
Posted By: JC-WI
Date Posted: 09 Sep 2020 at 10:56am
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DJ wrote in a different thread he started.... just hooking his new post to his old link. Well,,I had commented on wantin to help a friend out with his forklift but couldn't find the dang thread,,,so,,,here I go again. A
good friend has an older Hyster Model RT100 forklift that he was using
to move some old cars and trks around on his yard and the engine
finally crapped out. I had done a southern engineerin job on the
carburator as it was messing up and we could not locate a kit for it so I
made an "adapter" from the Hyster manifold to a Carter I had laying
around and it worked great till the engine crapped a couple of weeks
ago. The engine in forklift is a 6 cylinder gas Silver Diamond Model
GRD214. Then he bought what they told him was an
Industrial Ford 6 cylinder that would bolt up to the Hyster
bellhousing,,SOO I tool that engine home and was gonna get it tuned up
and running for him to stick in the forklift. Flash forward,,the engine
is out of a dang Ford Pinto or some such and it was locked up and after 2
weeks of the Acetone/Atf,treatment ,it finally broke loose but it has
ZERO compression,,,rings prolly stuck really good and since it is NOT an
industrial ,,it will not even bolt up to the hyster bellhousing. I
convinced him to either overhaul the Hyster engine or find a used
replacement somewhere. Does anybody here know if any other
engines will interchange since the Hyster's are almost non-existing,,,?
Prolly parts for his are gonna be even harder to find as well,,,,,,------------- He who says there is no evil has already deceived himself The truth is the truth, sugar coated or not. Trawler II says, "Remember that." |