WD wiring
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=159316
Printed Date: 28 Apr 2024 at 11:30pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: WD wiring
Posted By: Slowmotion
Subject: WD wiring
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 1:19pm
| I recently bought a WD that was about to be parted out. The fellow who owned it had bought it at an estate auction. I thought it looked too good to be parted out. It has no battery box or battery, and the generator looks as though it has not been wired into the electrical system for many years. My guess is that a battery was used to start it, and the battery was recharged between uses with house power and a battery charger. I know little about such things, and I’m wondering if that would make sense, and if putting a battery box and battery back in the system would be a reasonable approach to trying to get it running again. |
Replies:
Posted By: plummerscarin
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 4:40pm
| Your theory may be correct. That was the was how our Super M was before we inherited it. Generator was bad. After FIL died we just charged it overnight to use all day for cleanup. Just didn't use starter. Now that it's ours I converted to one wire alternator |
Posted By: Jim.ME
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 4:44pm
| I would do something temporary to hold a battery and try to get it running before buying a lot of parts. Distributor or magneto? Any idea if it was last run as 6 or 12 volt? If a distributor and there is a ballast resistor in the wiring ahead of the coil, they were likely running a 12 volt battery. |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 5:28pm
|
If you have a magneto ignition, a good battery will start the tractor many times without recharging, IF it's tuned up properly. I know a guy that has been using a 12 volt battery for years that way. He might put the charger on it once a month, just so he knows it's good to go the next time he needs it. I would find out how good the engine runs, before putting time and money into a charging system. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: Walter(MO)
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 5:29pm
| Figure out a way to hold a battery temporarily. You can hook up a battery and find out if motor is free or use a crank to check motor. If engine turns with a battery try to start the tractor with fresh gas and check for spark. No need to spend money on things like battery box and generator until you know what you are dealing with. Simple things first. |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 7:28pm
|
It will turn with a crank. There is a heavy rubber strap near the battery platform that looks like it was probably used to hold a battery in place. I would like to know if there are any major problems before I sink a lot of money into it. I need to figure out for certain if it’s 6 v or 12 before I buy a battery. I can’t lift car batteries anymore, so I’m going to put a battery box on it and get help putting a battery in it. If it’s worth a rebuilt generator, I wonder if it would be worth converting it to an alternator? If I get that far, it seems like this would be the time to do it. |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 7:48pm
| The spark plug wires come out of a bare metal attachment that has Fairbanks Morse Type FM on its side. It’s bolted onto a large metal thing that’s the same color paint as the rest of the tractor and appears to be original equipment. It has the firing order on it. At the front end of this is another bare metal piece bolted on that appears to be part of whatever the back end piece is. I see no coil or ballast or anything else. |
Posted By: Jim.ME
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 8:01pm
| You said the generator is unhooked, so you don't need to be concerned with it for now. If it has a magneto ignition system you can use either 6 or 12 volt battery to try starting it. If it has a distributor with a ballast resistor in the wire going to the coil it should be ok to use a 12 volt battery. If no resistor the battery needs to match the coil. With no battery hooked up take an ohm reading between the two primary wire terminals on the coil and post the reading. Battery voltage the coil is for can be determined from that. Polarity of the battery should also match coil polarity. Post a few photos someone may see something that might help. Good luck, hope things come together for you and it starts easily. |
Posted By: Jim.ME
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 8:02pm
| You have a magneto ignition. |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 8:16pm
| So if I have a magneto ignition and there is no coil, do I use a 6 volt or a 12 volt battery to start it. I used to have an F-20 that I cranked with no problems, but I'm leery of cranking now. |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 8:30pm
|
It won't care if you use 6 volt or 12. Just don't crank it for long periods of time. The Magneto has a coil, inside, but doesn't need outside voltage. The mag makes it's own spark. If there is a wire hooked to that little stud with the metal tab, remove it. It's a ground wire that shorts out the spark of the mag and if any part of the wiring or switch is grounded, it won't have any spark. You push that tab in to shut the engine down.  ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 8:48pm
| Looks like I pretty much have the info I need to move forward. Thanks everyone. I'm keeping my fingers crossed. |
Posted By: Krazy Karl
Date Posted: 24 Mar 2019 at 9:31pm
| Previous ower probably cranked it over by hand. And didn't use battery. Believe in operator manual states if not using battery to unhook generator. |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 26 Mar 2019 at 9:50am
|
With a magneto ignition, there is no need to buy a battery until you figure out if it's worth investing $ into. You can jump the starter with any 12 volt car or truck , just make sure you don't have any connections from the battery to any of the old wiring. Find out if it's gonna run, then worry about a charging system and battery. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 28 Mar 2019 at 2:41pm
| Where would the starter switch mount on this tractor? The control panel box is hanging by a wire, but there's nothing in it. I see a started switch advertised that seems to be contained in a box that is the same size and shape as that box. |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 29 Mar 2019 at 2:07am
| After doing a lot of digging, the light finally went on and I found where the switch is supposed to be, and it's there. And the long rod that's used to engage it is also there and attached. It looks like all I'd have to do is attach a battery. But I'll drain the fuel tank first and I'm thinking about changing the oil. It doesn't appear from what I've read and can see on the tractor that there is a fuel filter, other than the settling bowl. But maybe I should wait on changing the oil until I find out if it will start. The odds are probably 100 to 1 that it will need a new starter and switch. I bought a new battery box, and I'm wondering if there are batteries with terminals in the right place for the box? |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 30 Mar 2019 at 9:30am
|
If you follow original directions, "Buy Clean fuel, Keep it clean" there is no need for a fuel filter. That's what the sediment bowl is there for. It separates water and sedimenet from the fuel as it is used, and should be cleaned regularly. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: Dave(inMA)
Date Posted: 30 Mar 2019 at 10:11am
|
Re: proper sized battery - yes. Take measurements of your battery box. You want a battery with top-mounted terminals. Take your tape measure to your local battery store of choice and start measuring. Make sure that the box lid will clear the terminals with room to spare. ------------- WC, CA, D14, WD45 |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 30 Mar 2019 at 10:46am
Then add a piece of 1/4 inch plywood or hardboard flooring over the battery, before you put the top on. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Dave(inMA) wrote:Posted By: LouSWPA
Date Posted: 30 Mar 2019 at 11:27am
|
there was a lot of tractors of all flavors sold without a gen, or battery, or starter, w/magneto during the war ------------- I am still confident of this; I will see the goodness of the Lord in the land of the living. Wait for the Lord; be strong and take heart and wait for the Lord. Ps 27 |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 31 Mar 2019 at 12:21am
| The 26R group looks like it's about the right size, but the terminals are opposite each other, and the openings in my battery box are staggered. |
Posted By: Jim.ME
Date Posted: 31 Mar 2019 at 5:45am
| Offhand I can't think of a 12 volt having staggered (diagonally opposite) posts like the 6 volt group 1 batteries. You will need to change or rework the cables to fit the battery you get. As it appears you are converting to 12 volts you will be best to configure it as negative ground. |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 31 Mar 2019 at 12:09pm
| There's not much to convert. The lights and generator aren't wired up, and it runs off a magneto. I don't know if the starter is any good, but I seriously doubt it, and if it is, I've read that it should work with a 12v battery. Maybe the simplest thing is to cut another opening in the box. 12v is more readily available and probably cheaper. |
Posted By: chaskaduo
Date Posted: 31 Mar 2019 at 12:17pm
|
Maybe a longer cable would work before cutting the box. ------------- 1938 B, 79 Dynamark 11/36 6spd, 95 Weed-Eater 16hp, 2010 Bolens 14hp |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 31 Mar 2019 at 12:17pm
| Look at a grp 26, I think it's bass-ackwards of the 26-R. |
Posted By: Jim.ME
Date Posted: 31 Mar 2019 at 1:51pm
|
A new cable with few more inches of cable should be able to use the existing openings in the battery box, even if the terminals are both on one side of the battery, not staggered. A 26 has + on the left if looking down on the battery while standing on the same side as the posts. As DrAllis said, a 26R is the opposite, the + is on the right. |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 31 Mar 2019 at 2:36pm
| It looks like the cell covers would get in the way of one of the cables with either the 26 or the 26R, especially if I put an insulator between the posts and the lid. |
Posted By: Stan IL&TN
Date Posted: 31 Mar 2019 at 6:41pm
|
Before you start it the first time get a clean drain pan and remove the oil pan drain bolt for just a second to make sure you don't have a gallon of water in the bottom of the pan. If just oil comes out you can put it back in and go from there.🙂 ------------- 1957 WD45 dad's first AC 1968 one-seventy 1956 F40 Ferguson |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 31 Mar 2019 at 7:20pm
| Sounds Like a good idea. Thanks. |
Posted By: Slowmotion
Date Posted: 20 Apr 2019 at 7:17pm
| I got the battery wired in and tried the starter today. There was a little arc at about where the start lever connects to the solenoid, and then nothing. I put a charger on the battery and it didn't register, just hummed. I'm thinking a dead short in the solenoid or the starter, but I know little about this stuff. |
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 21 Apr 2019 at 7:54am
| I would pull the starter and take it to a starter/alt shop. They will probably check it out and not charge you anything unless you want them to fix it. |
Posted By: Steve in NJ
Date Posted: 21 Apr 2019 at 8:21am
|
I use the 526MF Deka Batteries for my 12V applications. That Battery fits in the stock Battery box with room to spare, and with 540 CCA's on tap, there's plenty there to spin a modified engine over never mind a stocker. If you decide to rewire the Tractor, we can help you out with whatever you need. Steve@B&B ------------- 39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife |