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Electronic Ignition Upgrade ?

Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=148580
Printed Date: 15 Aug 2025 at 9:28am
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Topic: Electronic Ignition Upgrade ?
Posted By: FREEDGUY
Subject: Electronic Ignition Upgrade ?
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2018 at 9:05pm
To those that have done the upgrade,is it necessary to change spark plugs? This would be on a 180. Thanks. By "change", I mean get a different AUTO LITE # or perhaps brand?



Replies:
Posted By: MACK
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2018 at 10:14pm
No.                      MACK


Posted By: DougS
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2018 at 6:07am
Perhaps keep the original kind of plugs, but I'd replace the wires with resistor wires, if it doesn't already have them.


Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2018 at 6:31am
If I didn't have a radio on it, I'd never ever use resister wires instead of wire wires.


Posted By: DougS
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2018 at 7:32am
Pertronix requires it with their new modules. RFI causes problems with more than just radios. I'm beginning to think the few reports I've seen from users here of electronic modules crapping out is due to RFI.


Posted By: dakotawc
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2018 at 7:40am
If you also  upgraded the coil, try experimenting with a wider plug gap.


Posted By: DSeries4
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2018 at 8:36am
It is not necessary to change the plugs when switching to electronic ignition, but I would check them out while you are working on the ignition system.  Recently I have been buying NGK spark plugs and have had good luck with them.


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'49 G, '54 WD45, '55 CA, '56 WD45D, '57 WD45, '58 D14, '59 D14, '60 D14, '61 D15D, '66 D15II, '66 D21II, '67 D17IV, '67 D17IVD, '67 190XTD, '73 620, '76 185, '77 175, '84 8030, '85 6080


Posted By: Steve in NJ
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2018 at 9:08am
Doug is right on. We got a bulletin last summer on RFI playing havoc with E.I.'s from Pertronix. Ever since we  got that bulletin, if a customer purchases an E.I. kit from us, I always ask them to check to see if the Tractor has solid core wires on it. Most of the time, they do, so I tell the customer we offer a resistor wire set or they can purchase a resistor set locally if they want, just so they don't lose that E.I. on a stray spike from the solid core wires being used. This does not effect performance at all on Battery Ignition systems.  Pertronix was getting a lot of failed E.I.'s back from the Tractor folks, and they think they finally figured it out. Since I started this program with us, I haven't had one call about a E.I. failing yet. So far, so good....  Thumbs Up    BTW, forgot to add, you don't have to change the plugs or coil. There is an optional Pertronix 40K coil that available, but not neccessary as long as you have the correct Coil for your particular application...
Steve@B&B


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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife


Posted By: ac45dave
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2018 at 10:27am
Originally posted by Steve in NJ Steve in NJ wrote:

Doug is right on. We got a bulletin last summer on RFI playing havoc with E.I.'s from Pertronix. Ever since we  got that bulletin, if a customer purchases an E.I. kit from us, I always ask them to check to see if the Tractor has solid core wires on it. Most of the time, they do, so I tell the customer we offer a resistor wire set or they can purchase a resistor set locally if they want, just so they don't lose that E.I. on a stray spike from the solid core wires being used. This does not effect performance at all on Battery Ignition systems.  Pertronix was getting a lot of failed E.I.'s back from the Tractor folks, and they think they finally figured it out. Since I started this program with us, I haven't had one call about a E.I. failing yet. So far, so good....  Thumbs Up    BTW, forgot to add, you don't have to change the plugs or coil.There is an optional Pertronix 40K coil that available, but not neccessary as long as you have the correct Coil for your particular application...
Steve@B&B

Here's the chart for correct coil appication to back up what Steve mentioned on correct coil for the aplication.    


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54 wd-45gas ; 56 wd-45d N/F w/fact p/s ; 63 d-17 sIII N/F gas ; 60 D14 N/F ; 67 d-17 sIV N/F gas ; 63D15 sII W/F; 39rc#667 ; 2021 massey 4710 fwa ; gravely 2 wheel tractors


Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 19 Mar 2018 at 6:43pm
My CA and Oliver 60 have both been running .045 plug gaps. They each have never started so well and ran so smooth. Plug fouling is a thing of the past.

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"Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford


Posted By: Charlie175
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 6:32am
Hmm, my 45 and 17 has Pertronix, can't remember switching out the plugs, wires or the coil at that time several years ago.



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Charlie

'48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD


Posted By: BrianC
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 6:53am
From the install sheets:
"Leaving the ignition “ON” with the engine “OFF” for an extended period could result in  permanent damage to the Ignitor".




Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 7:23am
Originally posted by Steve in NJ Steve in NJ wrote:

Doug is right on. We got a bulletin last summer on RFI playing havoc with E.I.'s from Pertronix. Ever since we  got that bulletin, if a customer purchases an E.I. kit from us, I always ask them to check to see if the Tractor has solid core wires on it. Most of the time, they do, so I tell the customer we offer a resistor wire set or they can purchase a resistor set locally if they want, just so they don't lose that E.I. on a stray spike from the solid core wires being used. This does not effect performance at all on Battery Ignition systems.  Pertronix was getting a lot of failed E.I.'s back from the Tractor folks, and they think they finally figured it out. Since I started this program with us, I haven't had one call about a E.I. failing yet. So far, so good....  Thumbs Up    BTW, forgot to add, you don't have to change the plugs or coil. There is an optional Pertronix 40K coil that available, but not neccessary as long as you have the correct Coil for your particular application...
Steve@B&B
That could explain why my brother's MSD electronic ignition failed within months on his D17. That was many years ago and he or I never tried electronic ignition since. Well that's not quite true as he put MSD on his '70 Dart and it hasn't been a problem though it only gets run about once a year and I am positive he has resistor wires on that of course.


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-- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... -
Wink
I am a Russian Bot


Posted By: CAL(KS)
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 7:47am
3 years and going on my UC puller with petronix and solid wires.  3 ohm oil filled 40k coil, no external resistors or bologna to be exposed.  toggle switch ignition and a light on the dash so it doesn't get left on Wink.  mini 3 wire alt running backwards, may switch to a set of resistor wires just to be safe but not a lick of trouble yet.

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Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20

Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15


Posted By: DougS
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 3:56pm
Originally posted by CAL(KS) CAL(KS) wrote:


3 years and going on my UC puller with petronix and solid wires.  3 ohm oil filled 40k coil, no external resistors or bologna to be exposed.  toggle switch ignition and a light on the dash so it doesn't get left on Wink.  mini 3 wire alt running backwards, may switch to a set of resistor wires just to be safe but not a lick of trouble yet.

In my countless years as a communications tech I've learned that you cannot predict how RF will act and how one component may tolerate it well, yet another unit will not. Someone else with an identical setup to yours may not have the same luck. I'd prefix your statement with a YMMV.


Posted By: CAL(KS)
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 4:06pm
whats ymmv?  lol

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Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20

Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15


Posted By: BrianC
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 6:14pm
On PerTronix website in the Frequently Asked Question section:

"What type of spark plug wires can I use with your Ignition system
Its very important to verify that your spark plug wires are compatible with the ignition system, or any on-board electronics in general. Solid core wires have a copper or stainless steel conductor and generate excessive Electromagnetic Interference (EMI). This EMI can create confusion with electronics and ultimately damage them. With all PerTronix ignitions we recommend that a suppression style spark plug wire (also called carbon core) be used. The suppression wires do an excellent job of controlling the EMI with no degradation to the ignition performance.

Help Topics: Ignition General Help, Ignitor Application Inquiry"


 I would add that carbon core wires have a limited lifetime.




Posted By: cwhit
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 6:45pm
We have 4 tractors with pertronics. CA, WD, WD45 And a D17. All trouble free EXECPT the WD. Guess it’s time to check the wires on that one.


Posted By: JayIN
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 7:55pm
Dammit! Now I gotta go outside and look.....

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sometimes I walk out to my shop and look around and think "Who's the idiot that owns this place?"


Posted By: DougS
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 8:05pm
Originally posted by CAL(KS) CAL(KS) wrote:


whats ymmv?  lol

Your mileage may vary. :)


Posted By: CAL(KS)
Date Posted: 20 Mar 2018 at 9:19pm
Ah,of course . Yes, not saying i was doing it the right way but only that i had not had trouble. And if pertronix is recommending surpressor wires now then we should be following suite to insure good service life.

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Me -C,U,UC,WC,WD45,190XT,TL-12,145T,HD6G,HD16,HD20

Dad- WD, D17D, D19D, RT100A, 7020, 7080,7580, 2-8550's, 2-S77, HD15


Posted By: jaybmiller
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2018 at 5:57am
re: this quote from the manufacturer..
"This EMI can create confusion with electronics and ultimately damage them."
 I'd like to know why they haven't added EMI supression to their units. This isn't 'rocket science' or expensive, less than $2 per unit, and would allow the unit to survive the low energy EMI the coil/plugs produce. 30 year ago my energy control system would servive near field lightning strikes,unlike the PCs sitting next to them.
Selling a product with a known defect just ain't right in my books.


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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)

Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water


Posted By: DougS
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2018 at 6:30am
Well yes, they could build it to mil specs too, I suppose. Have you priced mil spec items lately? As another (I forget who) pointed out a couple of weeks ago, it's best to use suppression on battery ignition systems anyway. He stated the reasons why. I'd look it up, but it's too early in the morning for my old mind.


Posted By: Steve in NJ
Date Posted: 21 Mar 2018 at 2:43pm
I've been reading here, and some of our customer's have been mentioning to me over the phone and in e-mails about the success they've been having with widening the gaps of the sparklers. I assume they are using the hotter 40K Coil to light that candle with the larger gap...
mailto:Steve@B&B" rel="nofollow - Steve@B&B


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39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife



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