Farm Equipment - Push rods got bent

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Push rods got bent

Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=130239
Printed Date: 02 Jun 2025 at 6:04pm
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Topic: Push rods got bent

Posted By: THEFOX
Subject: Push rods got bent
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 5:10am

My neighbor has a 175 Allis that had a water leak into the oil so he pulled the head off thinking it was the head gasket at fault. By the way it's a 226 gas engine. So he gets a new gasket and also has the head checked for cracks. Head is good so he puts it back together and cranks' it over and it bends four push rods!!!! What happened here? Valves are not stuck I tried them all. When he got the head back did he get the same one he took in? I don't know. Are there other heads that appear the same but differ in thickness? It appears to me that the rocker shaft pedestals are too short! Even with the adjusting screws backed all the way off you cannot tighten down the shaft without compressing the valve springs to the limit! Is there a spacer that fits between the head and the pedestals? Also what is the firing order of this engine? It seems weird to me 1243 is that right?

Replies:

Posted By: Charlie175
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 5:25am

I'm not aware that the head on the 175 was any different than a D17 series.

Yes the Firing order is 1243

Are you sure you have the rods inserted fully?

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Charlie

'48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD

Posted By: THEFOX
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 5:47am

Yes the push rods are in place correctly.

Posted By: WF owner
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 5:58am

Did they use the correct rocker arm "stands"? It sounds line they used the shorter stands when they rebuilt the head.

The correct stand should be 1.945" high.

Posted By: THEFOX
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 6:47am

I'll check on the stands today!

Posted By: Gary Burnett
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 7:13am

I'd double check the seating of the push rods,at any rate when I send a head,crank or anything to a shop I usually put some small mark on it that can't easily be taken off or noticed.Learned to do that years ago when working in a auto salvage yard,people would buy a used motor and bring the bad one they took out and claim it was the engine we sold them.

Posted By: Don(MO)
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 8:03am

If all the work is done right like installing the push rods, not changing the rocker arm assy. then look at what was done to the head like did the shop install new valves and or seats, plane the head? I'm thinking the shop might have installed the seats to deep in the head and or might be the wrong valves.

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3 WD45's with power steering,G,D15 fork lift,D19, W-Speed Patrol, "A" Gleaner with a 330 corn head,"66" combine,roto-baler, and lots of Snap Coupler implements to make them work for their keep.

Posted By: Brian G. NY
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 8:59am

The push rods are the same length for either the short or the tall head.

Therefore, the short head uses tall rocker stands and the tall head uses short stands.

So, is it possible they could have given you a short head in place of the original tall head? Otherwise (unlikely), it would seem that the valve stem length is wrong or (even more unlikely) you installed longer push rods from some other engine.

BTW, The short heads (used on the WCs and WDs prior to "engine" ser. #289001

are 3" thick and the tall heads used on later WD 201 engines and all the 226 engines measure 4" thick.

Posted By: THEFOX
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 9:47am

Thanks Guys for the quick response as, of tomorrow I'll be going to have my hip replaced and will be laid up a while. Thanks again

Posted By: THEFOX
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 10:14am

The measures 3 7/8" thick, the rocker arm pedestals measure just a hair over 1 15/16" . All new valves installed it appears as the stem ends show no signs of wear. Rocker arm assembly also appears all new as it is nice and shiney.

Posted By: Brian G. NY
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 11:35am

Just curious....were the 4 bent push rods either all exhaust or all intake valves?

Good luck on you hip; my son had a ceramic one installed a few years ago....what a relief after all the years of pain. Virtually none after the new hip.

Posted By: THEFOX
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 12:07pm

Not sure which they were as I didn't take it apart. Thanks for the good wishes.

Posted By: THEFOX
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 12:13pm

With out taking the head off does anyone know what the valve height would be measuring from the spring seat on the head to the end of the stem would be?

Posted By: Leon n/c AR.
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 3:59pm

Did he adjust the valves to correct clearance when reassembling. Leon

Posted By: Bill_MN
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 4:42pm

So.....are there marks on the pistons from valves hitting? Only way to bend push rods if valves aren't stuck is for valves to hit piston or springs to bottom out, not sure what will happen first but if valve stems are too long you will definitely have that problem. Were rocker arms disassembled from shaft? Did they get flipped upside down or backwards?

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1951 WD #78283, 1918 Case 28x50 Thresher #76738, Case Centennial B 2x16 Plow

Posted By: Brian G. NY
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 4:51pm

I hope you find out what happened and post your results.

Posted By: Dick L
Date Posted: 20 Oct 2016 at 6:00pm

I take it turning the engine over by hand to watch and check what was going on was not part of the process!

Posted By: THEFOX
Date Posted: 21 Oct 2016 at 5:19am

Originally he cranked it over with the starter. Since I've been helping out we've turned it by the pto shaft. While doing that the springs are bottoming out it appears. I think the valves are too long. Can't tell if there are any marks on the pistons as we have not taken the head off. The rockers are all right and were not disassembled. I looked at a couple of D17s yesterday and they measured the same as the 175. Once I get back on my feet I'll dig into it more. What is the length of the proper valves? Today I go for hip replacement so I,m out of commission till then. Thanks much guys.

Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 21 Oct 2016 at 6:33am

Are you sure you don't have the rocker arm supports flipped upside down?? This is silly. Something that should have taken 3 to 4 hrs to do has turned into a nitemare.

Posted By: SteveM C/IL
Date Posted: 21 Oct 2016 at 12:44pm

Something is really screwie here! If I remember I'll take a rough measure of the E head up at the shop...(valve tip height)

Posted By: Bill_MN
Date Posted: 21 Oct 2016 at 3:01pm

I think it would be difficult to get all wrong sizes on the valves. To have a valve with too long a stem but exactly the right dimensions otherwise, then to have springs that are also that much too tall seems like a large coincidence. There could be a bad vendor out there selling the wrong set, wonder if anyone else has had this problem?

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1951 WD #78283, 1918 Case 28x50 Thresher #76738, Case Centennial B 2x16 Plow

Posted By: Dan73
Date Posted: 21 Oct 2016 at 4:55pm

Do you or the shop still have the old valves and other parts for the head? It would help to double check the parts against the new parts. I am thinking that the rods where not seated right when the head was put back on the motor.

Posted By: THEFOX
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2016 at 8:20am

The push rods fit in a hole in the lifters so you can feel if they are in place or not. I just gat out of the hospital so won't be going outside for awhile. Once I get the head off I can check a few other things.

Posted By: AaronSEIA
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2016 at 9:30am

Is it even possible to have the rods not seated properly and have the valve train go together?
AaronSEIA

Posted By: Dan73
Date Posted: 23 Oct 2016 at 9:39am

When I put my d15 together I got one of the rods jammed up off to the side when I put it in felt funny so I asked the mechanic who I hired and was helping. It looks right at the top but was not seated right. I have no idea if you could have actually got the valve train together just thought it was worth mentioning that they can drop in and jam up.

Posted By: THEFOX
Date Posted: 02 Dec 2016 at 2:58pm

I replied on a new post as I couldn't find this one.