D10 hydraulic problem
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=120294
Printed Date: 01 Sep 2025 at 11:55am
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Topic: D10 hydraulic problem
Posted By: Ranse
Subject: D10 hydraulic problem
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2016 at 10:54pm
| I'm trying to restore a 1962 D10 series two. My biggest problem is with the hydraulic control valves. It has a 3501 Husco two spool control valve mounted between the right side of the seat and fender. It controls the three point hitch and the remote outlet. It also has traction booster. The original valve started dropping a few inches on the three point hitch when you released the lever. It also leaked badly. A guy found a used one for me which held better but also leaked. I replaced what few seals it has, which are basically O-rings, and it still leaked. The major leak is they squirt oil out the breather holes in the caps on the back of the valves. When my attempt failed I took both units to a hydraulic repair shop to see if they could fix at least one. They couldn't tell me why the original valve would let things drop other than maybe it's worn out. But they said rust pitting on the inside of the caps wouldn't let the O-rings seal properly. I tried to buy new caps but parts for this thing are on longer available. I took the caps to a machine shop and had them honed out. This removed the rust but not the pits and they still leaked. I even asked about making new caps and they said it could be done but wouldn't be practical. So I'm at my wits end, my only options are to find another valve in better condition or use an after market valve and re-plumb the entire system. This would do away with the traction booster. Any suggestions anyone? Can these valves be repaired, or is it possible to install an after market valve and make the traction booster work? I don't have much knowledge about this so any advice will be appreciated thanks. |
Replies:
Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 12 Mar 2016 at 11:30pm
|
Not that much of a job. The problem is making one or two is very cost prohibitive to some. I have thought about making them before, even asked if there was any interest. None was given here. What kind of money did they want for them. Several would be cheaper. HTH Tracy ------------- No greater gift than healthy grandkids! |
Posted By: Charlie175
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2016 at 7:23am
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I need 2! Although I did finally get mine to seal and quit squirting fluid out, it would be nice to have some good ones. I could maybe sell two more to other owner ------------- Charlie '48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD |
Posted By: jaybmiller
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2016 at 7:37am
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I did a quik google and Husco seems to be still in business. How about contacting them directly. You may find they have some parts , 'on the back shelf of the warehouse' collecting dust. If not, maybe they know of a dealer that has stuff, 'laying around'. I've lucked out in the past getting stuff that way, off them a deal and everyone is happy. option, always have options ! Jay ------------- 3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112 Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor) Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water |
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2016 at 9:06am
|
The machinist I talked to said he could make them but it would be very expensive. He didn't give me an exact dollar amount but he said I could buy an after market valve cheaper. He wasn't interested in doing it either. He told me he believed I would still have problems with the valve and it would be a waste of my money. I've been on Husco's web site to just to see if they sold anything that even looked like this valve. It looked like they into mostly commercial stuff now. I'm sure they would have all kinds of stuff but I have not tried to contact them. I'm not even sure how. I also got one of mine to stop squirting and the other one squirting just a little by using over sized O-rings and over tightening them. This however makes the levers hard to move and they will not return to the neutral position on their own. This is how I'm using now but I would like to get it right. It would be nice to find a good valve or at least some caps that aren't rusty. D10s are rare and its difficult to find stuff. |
Posted By: Dan73
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2016 at 9:22am
| If it was mine I would go to surplus center and buy a new power beyond valve with a joystick for the loader and if you get the right valve bank depending on the space you have you can add remote spool valves. A pair or two of double ended remote hydraulic valves is very useful. As far as plumbing them in it is easy you just plumb the new open center valves in place of the old one. The valve you have is open center so it can be replaced with any open center valve or valve bank for the same pressure and flow rating. |
Posted By: TimNearFortWorth
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2016 at 9:29am
| Got lucky on my D12 fence row find and the machine shop I use made them to look exactly like the originals. No idea what the exact charges were as he was doing other goodies on this unit at the time (3-4 years ago). Uphill battle if trying to get the old pitted end caps to seal well . . . |
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2016 at 5:39pm
|
I probably am going to have to use some other valve in the end. I would just like to keep it original and avoid a lot of ugly banjo work. Getting the cylinders to work up and down will not be that big of a problem I think, but I don't know how to get the traction booster rigged in or if it's even possible. And yes, it is an up hill battle. And if yours has been working for 3 or 4 years maybe I'll try to find another machinist willing to give it a try. |
Posted By: Dan73
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2016 at 5:50pm
| Is the pitting at the threads or in the seat for the oring? I was just wondering if you can fill the pits with JB weld and then sand it back smooth so you get a good seal. I haven't seen the setup you have so I don't know just an idea. As the the cylinders dropping there are soo many places a small leak can cause that or a loose fitting it is almost impossible to stop. My system is totally new on my d15 and the lift holds but the curl doesn't. I am betting it is a fitting loose somewhere on the cylinder lines but I will be darned if I can find the leak. |
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 13 Mar 2016 at 9:06pm
| No the pitting is in the back of the end caps. Moisture gets in through the breather holes in the ends. I don't think JB weld would work. You can barely put your finger inside one of these caps. Even if you could get it in there JB weld wouldn't hold up long, these things are made of harden steel I guess. I'm not familiar with a D15 but I say its more like a D17 with the control lever on the steering column. My system is totally different, kind hard to explain although. Thanks for your interest. |
Posted By: Charlie175
Date Posted: 14 Mar 2016 at 6:41am
|
Valve on left is with traction booster control. Right side is Non-TB http://smg.photobucket.com/user/RangerCharlie/media/Allis/IMG_4172_zps65ce6bb1.jpg.html" rel="nofollow">  ------------- Charlie '48 B, '51 CA, '56 WD45 '61 D17, '63 D12, '65 D10 , '68 One-Ninety XTD |
Posted By: RMD
Date Posted: 14 Mar 2016 at 12:15pm
| I can tell you from experience that HUSCO will be of no help what-so -ever. I hand one that was cracked and was able to get a salvage part. |
Posted By: shackratt
Date Posted: 14 Mar 2016 at 3:15pm
|
If someone could get me the dimensions of the cap and or a cap I am sure glad to try to make these for you guys. Its worth a try and if it works they will not cost much at all. Spools and caps are easy to make. its the valve body pitting that is hard. Just let me know. Sam ------------- AC 180, TO-20, Case 580B Case 450 dozer |
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 14 Mar 2016 at 9:30pm
| Yeah Sam, that sounds good. I have no way measure them precisely. They have a detent groove inside them, that's what the machinist I talked to said would make them expensive to make. They also have to be made out of very hard steel, so I've told. If you look at the pics that someone sent the caps on the valve with traction are about a half inch different in length. So you would need both caps to copy them. I have the caps I'm not using but I can't send them to just anyone you understand. I could get a micrometer and measure the length, diameter and depth of the hole, but those grooves would be more difficult. You would need the parts or a diagram. Thanks for the offer, maybe we can make it happen, not sure how. |
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 23 Jun 2016 at 8:18pm
|
I've been searching for months for a solution to my hydraulic problem. I talked to a new machinist willing to take on the challenge. He also said it would be to expensive to make new end caps due to the detent grooves inside them. Instead he is going to machine out the old caps and put a sleeve in them. He seems confident he can make this work, and it should work in theory. I gave him the go ahead, after all the caps are no good the way they are. I hope it works. |
Posted By: Dan73
Date Posted: 23 Jun 2016 at 8:21pm
| Make sure he is aware of the pressure your hydraulic pump genorators. The belly pump in the bigger d serries is higher pressure then the standard 3000 psi of modern pumps I don't remember the rating for the d serries pistions pumps off the top of my head just know it can blow lines on equipment if you don't check it. |
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 23 Jun 2016 at 9:59pm
| I have no ideal what the pressure rating on the D10 and 12s are. Anyway this will not effect any lines. He's only working on the control valve, and just the end caps at that. The caps will be somewhat thinner when done, I realize that. That's the only way to remove the rust pits. Hopefully there will still be enough material to do this and hold under the pressure. |
Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 23 Jun 2016 at 10:00pm
|
Post a pic of the parts or email one to me. They can't be that complicated. I make complicated stuff everyday, might not be cheap but it can be done. Tracy ------------- No greater gift than healthy grandkids! |
Posted By: GracieLu69
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 4:14am
| I knew it was a dumb idea, but I decided to complete this Charlie Challenge. It was a little bit scary but also very funny. You may find more information about it on this website http://skywritingservice.com/blog/what-you-should-know-about-charlie-charlie-challenge" rel="nofollow - http://skywritingservice.com/blog/what-you-should-know-about-charlie-charlie-challenge |
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 4:00pm
| I read the info on the web site and I have to say I've never heard of this game, but it sounds like the same basic principle as a Ouija board. It's interesting, but I'm confused on how it applies to my topic. Are you suggesting that I ask Charlie-Charlie how to fix my tractor? Maybe I should, and if that doesn't work I could climb to the top of a mountain and ask a guru. LOL! |
Posted By: TimNearFortWorth
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 4:12pm
|
Ranse, for as small as the caps are, a USPS 5.00 box will get them to Tracy. We looked at opening up two I had that leaked on a D12 for potential sleeving but the machinist that did mine made new ones and you can't tell the difference from OEM. He has since passed or I would have you send them to him. I have no doubt Tracy can make them, and he is even in your state. . . . |
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 5:20pm
| Hey, I PM Tracy about it before, but I ended up getting someone else to make them. I only briefly tested them, but I think they will be ok. The machinist I used did the same thing. He planned to sleeve them, but ended up making new ones. I'm waiting until I do my paint job before I install them permanently. I don't know when that will happen. I have to fix the roof on my building first. To damp to paint in it now. I first posted this topic back in March. I couldn't believe someone replied to it today. I also can't believe so many of you members actually know each other, kind of makes me feel like an outcast. Thanks for your help. |
Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 6:56pm
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What was the cost of the parts? Thanks Tracy ------------- No greater gift than healthy grandkids! |
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 8:47pm
| You asked that question before Tracy, and I thought I had answered it. Anyway Dwayne's machine shop in Manchester did the work. He had 11 hours in both caps at $35 an hour. He did cut me some slack and charged me $325. That was pricy. It would have been cheaper to re-plumb the tractor with an after market valve. But, I wanted to keep the tractor original and not lose the traction booster system. Now Tracy, I told you, now you tell me, could you have made those parts for that? I ask with respect out of curiosity. |
Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 27 Jan 2017 at 10:01pm
------------- No greater gift than healthy grandkids! |
Ranse wrote:Posted By: orangeman
Date Posted: 28 Jan 2017 at 5:13am
|
FWIW - HUSCO - Hydraulic Units Specialty Co. does not work with Individuals or the aftermarket. Unless their policy has changed, and when contacting them 15 years ago on a HUSCO monoblock hydraulic valve bank for a backhoe they stated - " We do not sell to individuals or the aftermarket strictly to OEM. After learning this I notice the Japanese Allis Chalmers - Kubota Tractors use Husco Valves - that might be a lead to pursue if you can find a valve that would replace the original unit Another way to think about this - have you contacted Prince Hydraulic Controls to ask about a replacement valve? Good Luck Orangeman
|
Posted By: Ranse
Date Posted: 28 Jan 2017 at 6:53am
| Tracy- What you stated above is basically what another machinist told me a year and a half ago. He wasn't even willing to do the job. He was afraid it wouldn't work and he didn't want to charge me all that money, so he said. I work at Bridgestone in Warren Co. and one of the machinist there referred Dwayne to me. They sub a little work out to him every now and then. I think he charges Bridgestone more than he did me, at least I hope he does. He seemed like a good guy, I believe he has a different rate for us old broke farmers. Thanks for answering my question, I'm sure you could have done a good job as well. |
Posted By: Tracy Martin TN
Date Posted: 28 Jan 2017 at 11:52am
|
Most people want the cheapest part price available. If you ever start making any reproduction parts you will find this out.Even though it cost X amount to produce there may be no market at said price. HTH ------------- No greater gift than healthy grandkids! |