Allis G Starting + Running Problems- HELP!
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=101961
Printed Date: 02 May 2025 at 2:46pm
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Topic: Allis G Starting + Running Problems- HELP!
Posted By: rdm1301
Subject: Allis G Starting + Running Problems- HELP!
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 7:27am
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Hi all - I'm at my wit's end with this Allis G. Full disclosure that I'm not very experienced with tractor repairs, but I do have someone with me that, while not a mechanic, at least knows his way around these things. Background: Allis G with Marvel Schleber TSV-13 Carb. Most parts original although the carb was probably rebuilt in 2000 (and then again yesterday). Used for years to cultivate tobacco here in Southern Maryland until 2001 and then sat for probably 7-8 years unused. Current problems: I'm a vegetable gardner and my tobacco farmer friend has gifted with the tractor with the caution that it is having problems running. He told me a bad battery so I immediately replaced that. Tried to start it up last week and got nothing- engine would flood but nothing turning over. Took the G out of the barn and had my friend tow me behind his tractor. Using that method we would get it started for about 30 seconds and then it would die. Decided it was a carb problem Purchased a rebuild kit from Steiner Tractor Parts - also a new sediment bowl assembly as that was leaking. Rebuilt the carb yesterday. Soaked in carb cleaner for 6 hours, used air on all of the passageways. Put it back together fine. Tried to start it up again and although the noises were different, still not luck. Took the tractor back to the hill and toed it and this time we got it started. Here is a video of how it sounds: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EIedrMvgobo" rel="nofollow - http://www.youtube.com/watch? Took it back to the barn and we could get it started without towing for a few tries. Then nothing again. What we think is the problem: Could be wrong here of course, but seems like a air/fuel mixture problem. We need the chock pretty much all of the way open to start it. We definitely have fuel - the sediment bowl stays full and the carb keep flooding. We've played with the idle screw and messed around with the points a bit to try to get the timing right. Not sure how to fix this at this point- don't want to throw another $100 at something that may not work, e.g. a new manifold. Pretty sure that carb is cleaned out good. We are getting sparks on all of the plugs (we checked). Battery is new. So help! I'm ready to kick this thing to death, but I've already spent too much time trying to revive it. That we got it working yesterday for a bit makes me want to stay with it. I'll follow the thread and am happy to post pictures, take more videos. Thanks friends. |
Replies:
Posted By: jaybmiller
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 8:50am
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re: flooding If you're talking about lots of raw gas coming out of the carb, then the needle valve is sticking or the float isn't adjusted correctly OR the float could be full of gas .Take float off and shake it, slosh-slosh...gas inside,bad. Either fix or replace with a new one($).Fix is easy,take heat gun,blow on float a bit, let gas turn to vapour, it 'steams out'.When all out, clean and solder the pinhole(where the gas came out). re: running. Be sure the spark plugs are in the correct order 1-2-4-3, check manual for where #1 is....I forget..only had 3 Gs, all gone.... LOTS of G guys here... all will reply when they see the query ! hth Jay ------------- 3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112 Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor) Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water |
Posted By: rdm1301
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 9:04am
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Thanks Jay - float is brand new and has been tested in water, so that's not the problem - but it could need an adjustment. Are other folks using the 1/4" setting with success? I'll check on the spark plugs - good question.
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Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 9:32am
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Timing on thte N62 Continental engine is 1,3,4,2 with number one being at the rear of the tractor. I am curious what you mean by "Are other folks using the 1/4" setting with success?". If you are talking about the float setting, turn the carb top upside down and hold level. The float should be level with the gasket surface of the casting. Here is where you need to use your lung power to check the needle and seat. Blow into the inlet, not with an air hose, while holding the carb top upside down. No air should pass by the needle with gravity holding the seat closed. Then the thing most people don't do, is turn the carb over and measure the drop of the float. Compare that to the depth of the bowl. Floats CAN drop too far and wedge in the bottom of the bowl causing flooding. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: rdm1301
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 9:42am
| Thanks - the carb rebuild kit specifies the following: "adjust the float by placing throttle body flange down and bend float lever close to to body so that float measures "1/4" inch from face of gasket to nearest edge of float..." |
Posted By: Steve in NJ
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 9:43am
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If this carburetor is flooding and dripping fuel, you have either a float problem, or a fuel delivery problem. This also leads to a spark plug fouling condition because of the flooding, so it increases the running issue problems all the way around. If that engine has been flooding all that time, the first thing you need to do is change the engine oil before you spin a bearing. Also, with fuel in the oil, you loose compression and ring seal on the cylinders which increases the running issues. Did you check to see if all the valves are opening and closing? If that wasn't looked at prior to you dragging the machine around trying to start it, it might have had a valve or two stuck because it sat so long, and now you possibly could have a bent valve or two. Getting back to the fuel issue, make sure you inspect the fuel tank for debris, water, and whatever else and clean out the tank. If this machine has been sitting for 7-8 years with fuel in it, your fuel delivery system is contaminated. Make sure the float level is correct on that TSV carburetor new or not. If its a new float, check to make sure the new float didn't take on fuel. Just cause' its new, doesn't mean its okay. There's not much to those carbs, but it doesn't take much to mess em' up. If this machine ran fine when it was parked, I wouldn't even be messing with the timing. Hopefully, you didn't bend any pushrods due to stuck valves or something like that. Hope you get that ole' girl ironed out... Steve@B&B ------------- 39'RC, 43'WC, 48'B, 49'G, 50'WF, 65 Big 10, 67'B-110, 75'716H, 2-620's, & a Motorhead wife |
Posted By: rdm1301
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 9:45am
| Thanks Steve! Good thoughts! |
Posted By: Dick L
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 10:10am
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The first thing I would do is do a compression check or at the very least remove the carburetor and hold the palm of my hand over the intake to feel how much vacuum it is creating. If you have a good vacuum I would then mist starting fluid directly into the intake without the carburetor to see if you can make it run. If you have vacuum and it will run on a starting fluid mist you have isolated your problem to the carburetor or fuel flow. Checking firing order, spark and timing is a must for the very first. All it takes to make an engine run is compression, spark at the proper time and fuel at the proper air mixture. Loss of any one will give you fits. |
Posted By: Bill Long
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 11:20am
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RDM 1301, Welcome to a fellow Marylander. Interesting if your friend can tell when the G was sold. Bowling and Mudd a dealership right outside of Prince Frederick sold many a carload of G tractors for tobacco planting and cultivation. As to your mechanical problem listen closely to what is said above. You have input from some of the finest Allis Chalmers Mechanics around. Compared to other Allis Chalmers Farm Tractors the G is a sewing machine cause it is sooo small so you have to be careful with the adjustments. Hope this is some help. Let us know how it goes. Good Luck! Bill Long
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Posted By: rdm1301
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 1:58pm
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I am curious what you mean by "Are other folks using the 1/4" setting with success?". If you are talking about the float setting, turn the carb top upside down and hold level. The float should be level with the gasket surface of the casting. Here is where you need to use your lung power to check the needle and seat. Blow into the inlet, not with an air hose, while holding the carb top upside down. No air should pass by the needle with gravity holding the seat closed. Then the thing most people don't do, is turn the carb over and measure the drop of the float. Compare that to the depth of the bowl. Floats CAN drop too far and wedge in the bottom of the bowl causing flooding @CTUCKERNWL ---------------------- Ok carb removed and here is what the float setting looks like. Any advice? Also I'm noticing the Float Valve needle gets stuck occasionally when I turn the top of the carb upside down - to right side up. The float valve is new - any ideas on keeping that from sticking?   |
Posted By: rdm1301
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 1:59pm
One more image: |
Posted By: Orange Blood
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 2:14pm
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Have you checked the air cleaner for an obstruction, if it is nearly completely blocked, you may get similar sympoms ------------- Still in use: HD7 WC C CA WD 2-WD45 WD45LP WD45D D14 3-D17 D17LP 2-D19D D19LP 190XTD 190XTLP 720 D21 220 7020 7030 7040 7045 3-7060 Projects: 3-U UC 2-G 2-B 2-C CA 7-WC RC WDLP WF D14 D21 210 7045 N7 |
Posted By: rdm1301
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 2:23pm
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Also can anyone confirm whether or not this square-hole (where the metering jet goes) is intentional or a flaw? Thanks again for all of your help.  |
Posted By: bobkyllo
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 7:16pm
| did you put a new seat in the carb when you installed the needle? |
Posted By: CTuckerNWIL
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 7:23pm
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which way is the needle sticking, up in the seat? Might be a slight burr that needs polished in the seat and those neoprene tips gotta have a smooth surface to set in. ------------- http://www.ae-ta.com" rel="nofollow - http://www.ae-ta.com Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF |
Posted By: rdm1301
Date Posted: 15 Feb 2015 at 7:37pm
| Seat and needle are both new. Needle is sticking in seat so perhaps I'll try polishing the seat a bit. |
Posted By: rdm1301
Date Posted: 15 Apr 2015 at 3:59pm
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Hi all, It has been almost two months since my initial question - the G still hasn't started. I've had a lot of help from a number of you - DiyDave, Fred in PA, and Bill long (and spoken to a few of you on the phone.) The long and the short of it is, she still isn't running (or at least not running well.) Since we have last spoke, I have done the following: 1. Purchased a brand new carb. I know I know... they are crap foreign made but I had cleaned that other carb more than 50 times. 2. Adjusted all of the valves (and corrected to the right clearance.) 3. Removed the fuel tank, cleaned it with chemicals, and resealed with POR 15. 4. Replaced the points, spark plugs, battery 5. Compression tested (we are at 85, 85, 85, 65) (from back to front). When I first got the tractor, it didn't run. Now it runs but it is misfiring and isn't running well enough to actually move out of idle. Essentially I need to adjust the timing depending on whether I am running in idle or going into gear. I've checked the advance on the distributor and that isn't the problem. So I'm stumped beyond belief. I've hired two mechanics, btw, and neither of them could figure it out either. Help?
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Posted By: Dick L
Date Posted: 15 Apr 2015 at 4:48pm
| Sounds like you have the spark wires on the wrong plugs. Firing order for the G is 1 3 4 2 . It sounds like you trying to run on 1 2 4 3 which is most old Allis Chalmers tractors except the G or you called number four number one. The Continental small engines will run on the 1 2 4 3 firing order like you describe. Number one is at the rear of the tractor. |