This site is not affiliated with AGCO Inc., Duluth GA., Allis-Chalmers Co., Milwaukee, WI., or any surviving or related corporate entity. All trademarks remain the property of their respective owners. All information presented herein should be considered the result of an un-moderated public forum with no responsibility for its accuracy or usability assumed by the users and sponsors of this site or any corporate entity.
The Forum Parts and Services Unofficial Allis Store Tractor Shows Serial Numbers
Forum Home Forum Home > Allis Chalmers > Farm Equipment
  New Posts New Posts
  FAQ FAQ  Forum Search   Events   Register Register  Login Login


Please Identify this Tractor - WD Maybe ?

 Post Reply Post Reply
Author
Message
BuckSkin View Drop Down
Bronze Level
Bronze Level


Joined: 12 Sep 2019
Location: Poor Farm
Points: 144
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuckSkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Please Identify this Tractor - WD Maybe ?
    Posted: 27 Nov 2022 at 9:44pm
I have ran into a conundrum in trying to identify this tractor, the first one with the blue-shirted guy in the seat.

I suspect it is a WD, but it may be something else entirely.

Of course, such things are easily changed, but this tractor has an alternator.

Take especial notice of the intake and exhaust manifolds.

This first photo taken 20-August-2016 at the Old Timer's Reunion in Adair County, Kentucky.

Now, look at the intake and exhaust manifold on this WD of unknown year model.

Also notice the generator (or whatever it is) that is almost as big as the engine.


Now, look at this 1952 WD.

It has a similar exhaust/intake arrangement as the unidentified tractor in the first photo.

And, to my eye, this generator looks to be about half the size as that of the one above.

This photo and the one above taken 27-July-2019 at the Central Kentucky Antique Machinery Show in Paris, Kentucky.

I have not been able to find any explanation about the difference in manifolds between the two known WDs pictured; which is the earlier and which the later; when did they change ?

Is the top photo a WD ? if not, then what is it ?

Many thanks for any help in solving my mysteries.


Edited by BuckSkin - 27 Nov 2022 at 9:46pm
Back to Top
Sponsored Links


Back to Top
DrAllis View Drop Down
Orange Level Access
Orange Level Access


Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Points: 17243
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote DrAllis Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Nov 2022 at 9:50pm
Top photo is a straight gearshift WD. Manifolds from WD45's get used on WD tractors as WD manifolds are discontinued. Alternators never came on any WD series. Again people upgrading old tractors.
Back to Top
BuckSkin View Drop Down
Bronze Level
Bronze Level


Joined: 12 Sep 2019
Location: Poor Farm
Points: 144
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuckSkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Nov 2022 at 10:03pm
Originally posted by DrAllis DrAllis wrote:

Top photo is a straight gearshift WD. Manifolds from WD45's get used on WD tractors as WD manifolds are discontinued. Alternators never came on any WD series. Again people upgrading old tractors.

Thanks.  

So the center photo is a WD45 manifold, correct ?

I hadn't noticed the gearshift poles before; I am assuming the curved pole is newer, right ?

When did they make the change ?

Thanks.
Back to Top
jvin248 View Drop Down
Bronze Level
Bronze Level
Avatar

Joined: 17 Jan 2022
Location: Detroit
Points: 157
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote jvin248 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 27 Nov 2022 at 10:08pm
.

There is another manifold with a rectangle cover plate that had something to do with kerosene.

The 'W' looking newer manifold has improved airflow and horsepower advantages over the older horizontal tubes type. One of the changes on the WD45 marketing for higher HP.


WD45 updates, dealer video : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Viw0LBJClM

.


Edited by jvin248 - 28 Nov 2022 at 5:25pm
Back to Top
sparky View Drop Down
Orange Level Access
Orange Level Access
Avatar

Joined: 13 May 2011
Location: So. Indiana
Points: 1133
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote sparky Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Nov 2022 at 11:15am
Looks like it has a Marvel carb on it. My grandpa’s 53 WD he bought new has a Zenith carb. Runs great but I know they are more persnickety so if it’s right don’t even think about touching it with a screwdriver. The W series tractors are tough old birds.
It's the color tractor my grandpa had!
Back to Top
LionelinKY View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level


Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Radcliff,KY
Points: 682
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote LionelinKY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29 Nov 2022 at 11:14pm
So the center photo is a WD45 manifold, correct ?

I hadn't noticed the gearshift poles before; I am assuming the curved pole is newer, right ?

When did they make the change ?

Thanks.
[/QUOTE]

Yes, the center photo shows what most will refer to as a WD45 manifold though it was used even after that with D17s and later too. Nowadays, it really is the only new manifold supplied as a replacement for all 201 and 226 CID applications. 

The WD had a straight gear shift lever from its introduction in 1948 up until late 1952 when the newer transmission was introduced with different gears and the curved shift lever.
"My name is Lionel and I'm an Allisoholic"
Back to Top
BuckSkin View Drop Down
Bronze Level
Bronze Level


Joined: 12 Sep 2019
Location: Poor Farm
Points: 144
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuckSkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2022 at 1:35am
Originally posted by LionelinKY LionelinKY wrote:

Nowadays, it really is the only new manifold supplied as a replacement for all 201 and 226 CID applications. 

Being from Kentucky, I am sure you have met "The Crack Doctor" AKA Ray's Crack Shop ; located on Hwy 210, between Campbellsville and Hodgensville, that guy can perform miracles with cracked, broken, and busted exhausts, intakes, and engine blocks.

In the 1980s, a friend had an exhaust manifold off of a Michigan loader that was broken in two pieces in the tube between flanges; my understanding is that those particular engines/manifolds were notorious for breaking in two.

We took it to a shop in Elizabethtown where they put it in an oven and slowly brought it up to heat for several days; ten or twelve days, if I remember correctly.

Prior to putting it in the oven, they sand-blasted it and bolted it onto a jig that had the same bolt-hole spacings as the engine.

Once the manifold had reached the peak temperature, those guys somehow welded it inside the oven, using Nickel rods.

After welding, it took just as many more days in the oven to slowly bring it down to normal temperature.

Once repaired, it lasted many more years and is still going strong. 
Back to Top
LionelinKY View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level


Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Radcliff,KY
Points: 682
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote LionelinKY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2022 at 4:33am
Being from Kentucky, I am sure you have met "The Crack Doctor" AKA Ray's Crack Shop ; located on Hwy 210, between Campbellsville and Hodgensville, that guy can perform miracles with cracked, broken, and busted exhausts, intakes, and engine blocks.

In the 1980s, a friend had an exhaust manifold off of a Michigan loader that was broken in two pieces in the tube between flanges; my understanding is that those particular engines/manifolds were notorious for breaking in two.

We took it to a shop in Elizabethtown where they put it in an oven and slowly brought it up to heat for several days; ten or twelve days, if I remember correctly.

Prior to putting it in the oven, they sand-blasted it and bolted it onto a jig that had the same bolt-hole spacings as the engine.

Once the manifold had reached the peak temperature, those guys somehow welded it inside the oven, using Nickel rods.

After welding, it took just as many more days in the oven to slowly bring it down to normal temperature.

Once repaired, it lasted many more years and is still going strong. 
[/QUOTE]

No, can't say that I have. I am a transplant from NY. I've been here in KY for 22 years now but have only had my tractors here from NY for 7 years since 2015. WD45 got a new manifold before coming here and the WD got 1 last year I bought online. I rarely get south of Radcliff with all the commuting I do into Louisville during the week for work. Seems like those old-time specialists are getting fewer and fewer. I can't even seem to find much local for radiator work or tire work which I do need soon.
"My name is Lionel and I'm an Allisoholic"
Back to Top
trace View Drop Down
Silver Level
Silver Level
Avatar

Joined: 01 Aug 2012
Location: N.W. Iowa
Points: 499
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote trace Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 30 Nov 2022 at 3:41pm
i have 55 wd45 curved shifter. marvel carb.


1955 WD-45 WIDE FRONT W/ TRIP
LOADER
Back to Top
LionelinKY View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level


Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Radcliff,KY
Points: 682
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote LionelinKY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2022 at 12:31am
The original manifold that my 1949 WD had on it. It was broken in 2 pieces at 1 time and Dad had JB welded it once which was letting go again plus the mating surfaces were badly eroded from running too long with bad gaskets. I finally got a good salvaged 1 online and now the WD matches with my WD45.

"My name is Lionel and I'm an Allisoholic"
Back to Top
LionelinKY View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level


Joined: 12 Sep 2009
Location: Radcliff,KY
Points: 682
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote LionelinKY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 01 Dec 2022 at 12:37am
My WD45 not long after I had replaced the manifold on it years ago back in NY. The old one was the same style as the 1 that is pictured here but was also badly eroded around the exhaust ports from running too much with bad gaskets.
"My name is Lionel and I'm an Allisoholic"
Back to Top
DaveKamp View Drop Down
Orange Level Access
Orange Level Access
Avatar

Joined: 12 Apr 2010
Location: LeClaire, Ia
Points: 5137
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote DaveKamp Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Dec 2022 at 6:30pm
Welding ANY casting properly requires bringing it up to a high temperature, and Iron is a perfect example.  Cast iron needs to be ductile to survive welding, and a high-nickel rod brings ductility to the iron in the immediate welding area.  Frequently, the weld area is very ductile, but the remaining parent metal around the periphery, is not, and as the weld's Heat Affected Zone is cooling, it is shrinking (just as it expanded during the welding process) and the non-ductile periphery because stressed, and a new fracture appears.

Exhaust systems fracture for only two reasons:  They're not ductile, and they're heating and cooling.  We don't melt down fine wine glasses and twist them into coil springs for cars, but they make an impressive spring as long as they're not pushed past their limit.

Allis exhaust manifolds are, in comparison to every other engine manifold of the time, generally some of the best, and not just because A-C was a foremost wizard of foundary process, but also because they knew that something attempting to expand, was best to allowed to do so...  there's a little slack to allow linear growth in the 'log'.  This put the gaskets between under a fair amount of stress, and they tended to fail a bit, usually more on the #1 and #4 cylinders, due to the manifold wanting to 'bow' itself outward.  The end result was erosion from the end gaskets, seemingly most often at the #1 end... but a burned-away manifold can sometimes be skimmed flat with a face mill (or in my case, a single-point flycutter worked fine, too).

But all the tractors above are WD's.

The suggestion of a WD-45, is the curved shifter (though later WDs had them, and the angle-cut gears), and the lack of large cover on one side of the block...  the WD45's 226ci didn't have that cover that appeared on both WC and WD 201ci engines.
Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
Back to Top
BuckSkin View Drop Down
Bronze Level
Bronze Level


Joined: 12 Sep 2019
Location: Poor Farm
Points: 144
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote BuckSkin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Dec 2022 at 8:12pm
Originally posted by DaveKamp DaveKamp wrote:

a burned-away manifold can sometimes be skimmed flat
Thanks for the explanations about ductile iron.

Also, I never was aware that a spring could be made from a wine glass.

The exhaust manifolds on my 1978 K-20 Chevrolet with HD 350 got burn damage and I took them to a shop where they trued them with what was basically a huge wide-belt sander with a dead true bed.

When they got done with them = no more exhaust leaks and I still have that truck and the manifolds haven't been off since.

It has over half-a-million miles pulling big gooseneck cattle trailers all over the United States.

Then I got me a 1985 F-350 Diesel, pulled bigger trailers, and tripled the amount of money I kept in my pocket after each trip.

Then I swapped out the V-8 6.9 I-H for a 6BT Cummins and quadrupled the amount of money I still had in my pocket compared to the 6.9 and could gain speed going up grades that would have the 6.9 dropping two gears and wondering if it was going to make the top.  
Back to Top
CTuckerNWIL View Drop Down
Orange Level
Orange Level
Avatar

Joined: 11 Sep 2009
Location: NW Illinois
Points: 22799
Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote CTuckerNWIL Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 06 Dec 2022 at 7:14pm
Originally posted by BuckSkin BuckSkin wrote:

I have ran into a conundrum in trying to identify this tractor, the first one with the blue-shirted guy in the seat.

I suspect it is a WD, but it may be something else entirely.

Of course, such things are easily changed, but this tractor has an alternator.

Take especial notice of the intake and exhaust manifolds.

This first photo taken 20-August-2016 at the Old Timer's Reunion in Adair County, Kentucky.

Now, look at the intake and exhaust manifold on this WD of unknown year model.

Also notice the generator (or whatever it is) that is almost as big as the engine.


Now, look at this 1952 WD.

It has a similar exhaust/intake arrangement as the unidentified tractor in the first photo.

And, to my eye, this generator looks to be about half the size as that of the one above.

This photo and the one above taken 27-July-2019 at the Central Kentucky Antique Machinery Show in Paris, Kentucky.

I have not been able to find any explanation about the difference in manifolds between the two known WDs pictured; which is the earlier and which the later; when did they change ?

Is the top photo a WD ? if not, then what is it ?

Many thanks for any help in solving my mysteries.


 Manifolds and generators can easily be changer over the years. What CAN'T be changed, is the WD straight shifter that was used until late in 1952. The first picture is definitely an early WD(1948 to 1952).
http://www.ae-ta.com
Lena 1935 WC12xxx, Willie 1951 CA6xx Dad bought new, 1954WD45 PS, 1960 D17 NF
Back to Top
 Post Reply Post Reply
  Share Topic   

Forum Jump Forum Permissions View Drop Down

Forum Software by Web Wiz Forums® version 11.10
Copyright ©2001-2017 Web Wiz Ltd.

This page was generated in 0.066 seconds.


Help Support the
Unofficial Allis Forum