HYDRAULICS 200 AC HELP

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POSTED A WHILE BACK ABOUT GETTING PRESSURE TO THE PD ON A 200 ALLIS. I SEPERATED THE TRACTOR AND THE PD WAS TOAST. REPLACED ALL THE CLUTCH DISC AND PLATES, REPLACED THE PISTON RINGS AND REPLACED THE THREE RINGS AND HOUSING. PUT TRACTOR BACK TOGETHER AND HAD IMPROVEMENT ON THE PD PRESSURE. HOWEVER STILL LOW. I WAS ABLE TO NOW SHIMM UP TO 300 PSI. THAT WAS GREAT BUT, NOW THE POWER STEERING WILL HARDLY TURN. IT IS NOT BINDING AND PRESSURE AT PRIMARY PORT IS TO HIGH, 1000 TO 1400LBS PSI. THIS STAYS THE SAME WHILE ATTEMPTING TO TURN OR AT REST. WHEN I ATTEMPT TO TURN THE STEERING WHEEL IT IS AS IF IT IS TURNING AGAINST PRESSURE. AS I AM ATTEMPTING TO TURN WHEEL, IF I SHIFT THE PD IT SEEMS THAT MOMENTARY IT HELPS BUT QUICKLY RETURNS. THE PUMP HAS BEEN REBUILT, I TOOK OUT THE METTERING VALVE CLEARED ONE SMALL HOLE, THE REST WERE CLEAN AND REPLACED. IT ALSO SEEMS TO BUILD HEAT QUICKLY. I HAVE TRIED AND CHECKED EVERYTHING IN THE SHOP MANUAL. CAN SOMEONE TELL ME WHAT I AM DOING WRONG OR MISSING?

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ac-mike Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Kentucky Points: 258	Post Options Post Reply Quote ac-mike Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Topic: HYDRAULICS 200 AC HELP Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 3:39pm
	POSTED A WHILE BACK ABOUT GETTING PRESSURE TO THE PD ON A 200 ALLIS. I SEPERATED THE TRACTOR AND THE PD WAS TOAST. REPLACED ALL THE CLUTCH DISC AND PLATES, REPLACED THE PISTON RINGS AND REPLACED THE THREE RINGS AND HOUSING. PUT TRACTOR BACK TOGETHER AND HAD IMPROVEMENT ON THE PD PRESSURE. HOWEVER STILL LOW. I WAS ABLE TO NOW SHIMM UP TO 300 PSI. THAT WAS GREAT BUT, NOW THE POWER STEERING WILL HARDLY TURN. IT IS NOT BINDING AND PRESSURE AT PRIMARY PORT IS TO HIGH, 1000 TO 1400LBS PSI. THIS STAYS THE SAME WHILE ATTEMPTING TO TURN OR AT REST. WHEN I ATTEMPT TO TURN THE STEERING WHEEL IT IS AS IF IT IS TURNING AGAINST PRESSURE. AS I AM ATTEMPTING TO TURN WHEEL, IF I SHIFT THE PD IT SEEMS THAT MOMENTARY IT HELPS BUT QUICKLY RETURNS. THE PUMP HAS BEEN REBUILT, I TOOK OUT THE METTERING VALVE CLEARED ONE SMALL HOLE, THE REST WERE CLEAN AND REPLACED. IT ALSO SEEMS TO BUILD HEAT QUICKLY. I HAVE TRIED AND CHECKED EVERYTHING IN THE SHOP MANUAL. CAN SOMEONE TELL ME WHAT I AM DOING WRONG OR MISSING?
	D-12III, 200D, 170G, HD-3, D19D 3pt, D17D High Crop, WD45G p/s, D15IID, D15IIG, D15G IND, 655, (3)WD45D p/s, 700, 816

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DrAllis Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Access Joined: 12 Sep 2009 Points: 19477	Post Options Post Reply Quote DrAllis Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 10 Feb 2020 at 3:59pm
	Not sure where to start with this. If the Power Director pressure is 300 lbs at the P.D. valve, I would expect the power steering inlet pressure to be less than 400 psi when not turning the steering wheel. Are you sure the priority spool in the back section of the pump is free to slide and installed properly?? Spring goes to the outside if I remember correctly. I had a 7000 tractor one time that took high effort to steer and it had plugged passages inside the steering orbitrol. The one and only time I have ever seen anything like that. Steering flow goes from the pump thru the oil cooler ahead of the radiator to the orbitrol and then down to the PTO valve and then Power Director clutch. Back pressure is made at the P.D. clutch by the pressure regulator. Steering pressure rises and falls depending on how much effort it takes to turn the front wheels, but downstream the Power Director keeps things in the 300ish range from the orbitrol outlet and beyond.

ac-mike Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Kentucky Points: 258	Post Options Post Reply Quote ac-mike Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Feb 2020 at 3:26pm
	THANKS DR. ALLIS, I AM STILL WORKING WITH THIS 200AC. I FIRST THOUGHT THERE WAS A PROBLEM WITH THE ORBIT CONTROL, DISASSEMBLED CLEANED AND CHECKED BUT FOUND NO PROBLEMS. IT WAS VERY STRANGE THAT WITH THE STEERING SO HARD THAT WHEN ENGAGING THE PD IT WOULD MOMENTARLY HELP. FOR SOME REASON THE PD VALVE GOT HARD TO SHIFT. I DISASSEMBLED THAT VALVE AND POLISHED THE MATING SURFACES WHICH SMOOTHED IT UP. I THAN REMOVED THE SHIMMS I HAD ADDED TO GET THE PRESSURE UP TO 300lbs WHICH WAS ABOUT 3/16". I REASSEMBLED AND THE PRESSURE AT THE PD WAS AROUND 200lbs AND THE P/S WAS AGAIN WORKING, THE ODD PRESSURE READINGS WERE GONE AND PUMP WAS NOT GENERATING THE HEAT. I AGAIN ADDED 4 SHIMMS BUT DID NOT SEEM TO CHANGE THE PRESSURE. AM I CORRECT TO ASSUME THAT I COULD HAVE SHIMMED TO THE POINT I JAMMED THE PRESSURE RELIEF CAUSING THE PROBLEMS I WAS HAVING WITH THE STEERING AND ODD PRESSURE READINGS AT THE PUMP CHECK PORT. IS IT POSSIBLE TO HAVE A BAD RELIEF IN THE PD VALVE?
	D-12III, 200D, 170G, HD-3, D19D 3pt, D17D High Crop, WD45G p/s, D15IID, D15IIG, D15G IND, 655, (3)WD45D p/s, 700, 816

ac-mike Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Kentucky Points: 258	Post Options Post Reply Quote ac-mike Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Feb 2020 at 3:52pm
	I WAS READING SOME OTHERS POSTS ON PD VALVES. I AM TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THE PRESSURE RELIEF A LITTLE BETTER. DR. ALLIS'S POST MENTIONED AND ANOTHER GENTLEMAN WROTE ABOUT THE VALVE SPOOL HAVING A MOVABLE SLUG. CAN SOMEONE EXPLAIN THAT MORE FOR ME?
	D-12III, 200D, 170G, HD-3, D19D 3pt, D17D High Crop, WD45G p/s, D15IID, D15IIG, D15G IND, 655, (3)WD45D p/s, 700, 816

Dave H (NE) Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Silver Level Joined: 11 Sep 2009 Location: Western NE Points: 284	Post Options Post Reply Quote Dave H (NE) Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 19 Feb 2020 at 7:34pm
	the plunger in the end of the spool must be free to move for relief valve to work. pressure will be low if it is stuck. plunger clearance is .0004 to .0008. check the .018 diameter hole in the spool for plugging.

tbran Members Profile Send Private Message Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Orange Level Joined: 14 Sep 2009 Location: Paris Tn Points: 3238	Post Options Post Reply Quote tbran Report Post Thanks(0) Quote Reply Posted: 20 Feb 2020 at 12:53pm
	in addition to what Doc sez, we once had the ball that checks flow for dead stick steering come out and block flow. We also have had a piece of oring or spring, flake of aluminum, etc held the ps relief valve off the seat - thus dropping pressure - it is under the adjustable shim for the PS in the end of the pump.
	When told "it's not the money,it's the principle", remember, it's always the money..