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Flyer 
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 Topic: Not Allis - Anybody Know What This Is?
Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 9:00am |
I have a friend that would up with this machine included in a real estate deal and he has no idea what it is. I haven't seen anything other than the picture below.
He claims the engine appears to be a John Deere but there are no manufacturer nameplates he can find on the machine. It has a problem with the hydraulics and he's trying to figure out where to find parts.
Any help would be appreciated.
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An optimist sees the glass as half full. The pessimist sees the glass as half empty. The engineer sees a glass with double the required capacity.
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TramwayGuy
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 11:23am |
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Maybe an early ‘Swinger’?
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Brian F(IL)
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 1:27pm |
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A buddy of mine used to run a fertilizer plant. He had something that looked similar. I believe the name of his was a "Wrangler" or something like that.
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Anthony
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 1:29pm |
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It looks like a Waldon to me. Made in fairview Oklahoma
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TramwayGuy
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 3:04pm |
Here is a Swinger on a Craigslist: https://nwct.craigslist.org/grd/d/pequabuck-4x4-diesel-compact-loader/6786975797.htmlSome of the others have too many things that aren’t close enough to yours.
Edited by TramwayGuy - 13 Feb 2019 at 3:06pm
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DMiller
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 3:14pm |
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Tons of oddballs as these around, made by up and coming then left as the doors closed shops. Best bet is try to find ANY numbers on it and call the local hydraulics shops as to what they can come up with.
Only option go on Machinery trader and look at every line of Wheel Loader, thought may have been Wacker Nuesman but not.
Edited by DMiller - 13 Feb 2019 at 3:26pm
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Gary Burnett
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 4:18pm |
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Neat loader.What motor does it have in it?
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JohnCO
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 4:32pm |
I think it's a Prime Mover. They used JD engines. Don't think the company is still in business but there was one on EBay not long ago. Search "Wheel loaders"
Just looked it up, none on Ebay but Googled Prime Mover, I'm sure that's what it is. Found out they were made by John Deere for the Prime Mover company. Seem to be good machines and most parts are still available from the manufacturers.
Edited by JohnCO - 13 Feb 2019 at 4:44pm
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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Jim.ME
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 5:47pm |
I think JohnCO got it. Apparently they were also under the Lull name at one time. Here is a link to a LD50 on craigslist, it looks right other than not having a full cab. https://cnj.craigslist.org/hvo/d/hellertown-wheel-loader-small-4x4/6817668968.html . Minnpar has Parts Manuals in their on line manuals, so they may be a resource.
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Don(MO)
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 5:54pm |
John's right. Here's one just like it.
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3 WD45's with power steering,G,D15 fork lift,D19, W-Speed Patrol, "A" Gleaner with a 330 corn head,"66" combine,roto-baler, and lots of Snap Coupler implements to make them work for their keep.
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chaskaduo
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 5:55pm |
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Yep this is the bestest forum ever!
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1938 B, 79 Dynamark 11/36 6spd, 95 Weed-Eater 16hp, 2010 Bolens 14hp
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TramwayGuy
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 9:24pm |
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I agree - - it’s a Lull / Prime Mover.
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Flyer
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Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 10:06pm |
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^Thanks! That should give my friend enough information to get where he needs to go. This is an awesome forum indeed.
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An optimist sees the glass as half full. The pessimist sees the glass as half empty. The engineer sees a glass with double the required capacity.
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DKB552
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Posted: 28 May 2019 at 7:10pm |
It's a Prime Mover LD-50. I have one that I use on my property. Mine has the Deere 3164d engine. The company is out of business, but the good thing is the Prime Mover company didn't actually make the mechanical parts and many of the parts were used on other machines. So most of the parts can easily be found. You didn't specify the problem with the hydraulics. If the hydraulic pump itself is bad (located under the radiator and oil cooler) then nothing will work. If the pump is making a constant loud noise, check the spline coupling located on the shaft connected to the pump. The splines on the coupling become worn down to the point where it just spins on the shaft and doesn't turn the pump. This is what I'm repairing on mine as we speak. I'm also replacing the rubber coupling connected to the crankshaft while I have it apart. Both parts are available. If the spline coupling isn't the problem and if the pump itself is bad, that's probably the hardest thing to find for this machine. It's a priority valve gear pump (CCR) made by Tyrone Hydraulics which is no longer in business. I done some searching and found one that appears identical to the one on the machine and made by Parker mfg. It can be found in the Parker Catalog (Catalog # HYP9-1000/US) called the "PVP 16 series" with a 13 spline shaft (Pages 12 and 13)
If the problem is with the hydrostatic pump( located under the hydraulic tank), the first signs of problems is when the machine continues to roll when the foot pedals are released, which is very dangerous. This has something to do with the neutral control switch and is usually a sign the pump is beginning to fail. (my own experience). Eventually over time the machine will stop working in either forward or reverse which requires replacement of the entire pump. The pump is made by Sundstrand Sauer, model # 22-2069. The hydrostatic motor connected to the pump is probably OK (Sundstrand Sauer 22-3077). When replacing the hydrostatic pump, the oil cooler must be replaced as well along with flushing out the entire hydraulic system (all the hoses, tank strainer, etc) to cover the warranty on the pump. It's labor intensive, but not bad considering how much is saved when doing the work yourself.
The last issue would have to be with the bucket control valve which can easily be rebuilt at a local hydraulic shop. I have a lot of other information for these machines if anyone has any questions. I've saved a ton of money doing all the work myself and it's a lot cheaper than buying a new one. The first thing that needs to be done when buying one of these machines is a total hydraulic system flush because you have no idea what type of fluid has been used in it. With hydrostatic pumps, it's important that only high quality premium tractor fluid be used, not the cheaper low quality tractor fluid.
Also when buying one of these machines, I would remove the axle covers and axle shafts and flush out the entire axle housing because more than likely it's never been done. On mine I was amazed how much crud was found inside. I also replaced the axle oil seals and hub bearings because they were shot. I have part numbers for those as well. |
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Flyer
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Posted: 28 May 2019 at 8:23pm |
^Thanks! All I have for a description of the problem is what my friend told me. I haven't actually seen it myself.
I'm going to copy your post to an email for him.
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An optimist sees the glass as half full. The pessimist sees the glass as half empty. The engineer sees a glass with double the required capacity.
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DKB552
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Posted: 12 Aug 2019 at 11:28pm |
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Does your friend still have the Prime Mover LD50 loader??? I'm in dire need of the make and model number of the hydraulic pump located under the radiator. The tag on my pump is missing. The model number is a metal tag on top of the pump. The rear grill on the back of the machine has to be removed to view it. These are obsolete pumps and I'm having a hard time finding one. I can't find anyone who owns one of these loaders.
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Flyer
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Posted: 15 Aug 2019 at 7:15am |
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They still have it as far as I know. I'll see if he can get a picture the next time he's up there.
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An optimist sees the glass as half full. The pessimist sees the glass as half empty. The engineer sees a glass with double the required capacity.
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DKB552
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Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 12:13pm |
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JohnCO
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Posted: 16 Aug 2019 at 1:04pm |
I'm betting that if you take that pump to a good hydraulic shop, they can tell you what it is and what will replace it. You can probably find one on the internet cheaper but maybe it's worth supporting a local business. I've been looking for a pump for an IHC 3200 skid steer loader but haven't taken the time to search it out, it mounts to the pump drive housing and has a tapered shaft with a gear on it, kind of different. I heard whoever built them made them for MF too.
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"If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer"
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DaveKamp
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Posted: 17 Aug 2019 at 3:51pm |
A 'priority' pump is an ordinary hydraulic pump with a 'priority flow' valve.
The priority flow function is simple- if the pump is running in any circumstance where it's demand is exceeded, a selector valve shifts to make certain that the 'priority output' port gets full flow, and the 'secondary' port is the one that sees limitation.
The PRIORITY function is typically used for steering circuits, with the secondary going to bucket control, etc., so that you're not stuck running a machine that has limited steering.
I used a priority pump on my homemade front end loader tractor, and it's convenient in packaging, but I could have simply installed a priority flow control valve downstream of the main pump output (this is how they USED to be made)... just so happens I found a perfect solution (integrated priority) at one of our favorite surplus retailers... so I didn't HAVE to.
on a machine like this, a good option is to replace the pump with a standard, of similar or slightly greater displacement, and install a priority valve just past the output, mounted at some safe, yet convenient location inside the chassis. that appears to be a C-face pump, should not be hard at all to match.
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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.
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DKB552
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Posted: 17 Aug 2019 at 11:26pm |
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Yes, I've taken it the local Hydraulic shop and the old man there said it appears to be an obsolete Tyrone pump, but Parker has one that looks exactly like it in an older catalog. So if it's not a stocked item I'm sure they could build one....with a hefty price tag. The pump still works but the spline shaft is worn so the spline coupling that fits on the shaft is loose. Which means it will soon stop working. The problem is the repair parts including the seals, pressure plates, etc. all come as a kit which is no longer available for this pump. So for the time being I came up with a quick fix temporary solution.(which I've done in the past on something else) I purchased a new spline coupling and drilled and tapped 3 equally spaced 1/4-20 holes around the coupling. I used 1/4-20 stainless steel set screws and this keeps the coupling completely tight against the worn out spline shaft. I've been using it for a month now with no problem. But this is only a quick fix. Once I get another pump then I'll feel safer. I've searched high and low on e-bay and found 2 that looks exactly like it made by Parker.(called a PVP-16 priority valve pump). But Parker makes like 8 different versions. That's why I need the exact model number of the pump I have. The last thing I want to do is order something that doesn't work.
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DKB552
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Posted: 17 Aug 2019 at 11:49pm |
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Parker hydraulics has this style of pump listed as "PVP-16 priority valve gear pumps" but they have several different models. Which is why I need to know exactly what model I have so it can be cross referenced. This is the only item on this machine I've had trouble finding. The hydrostatic moter, hydrostatic pump, steering pump and other items are available. I'll will be listing everything I've bought along with part numbers on this board in the future in case someone else runs across one of these rare machines.
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