190xt Power director pressure
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=44983
Printed Date: 27 Jul 2025 at 5:18pm
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Topic: 190xt Power director pressure
Posted By: 2wise4agm
Subject: 190xt Power director pressure
Date Posted: 04 Feb 2012 at 11:50am
| My 190xt's power director will slip in high side under heavy load. I checked pressures this morning, and have 320psi in both high and low. The strange thing is my manual says I should have 60psi in neutral, and I have 210-220. Can anyone tell me what that means? |
Replies:
Posted By: DougG
Date Posted: 04 Feb 2012 at 12:48pm
| I got the same problem on a 200 - no neutral ; just looking for a cause for the problem before i tear into it!! I am thinking broken PD clutch discs but want to know for sure |
Posted By: 2wise4agm
Date Posted: 04 Feb 2012 at 12:54pm
| I still have neutral. I just want to make sure I dont have another problem before I tear into the clutch discs. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 04 Feb 2012 at 2:32pm
| Where are you measuring your pressure?????? there are TWO 1/8" pipe plugs for two gauges on the side of the valve ...one for LOW and one for HIGH....any other place for measuring pressure is pretty much useless. 320 in HIGH and 320 in LOW and zero pressure on both gauges in neutral. |
Posted By: 2wise4agm
Date Posted: 04 Feb 2012 at 4:36pm
| Im going off of what my IT manual said. You measure it at a 't' fitting just in front of the operators stand on the RH side of the machine. I see the plugs you are talking about, and i'll see what I have there tomorrow. Thanks |
Posted By: Orange Blood
Date Posted: 04 Feb 2012 at 5:09pm
|
Hate to be this way, but that's what you get for buying a junk manual! :-) The IT manuals are just not very good manuals, the Allis manuals will be two to three times as thick, and only cover one tractor, now you have an idea as to how much more information is in a factory Allis Service manual. ------------- Still in use: HD7 WC C CA WD 2-WD45 WD45LP WD45D D14 3-D17 D17LP 2-D19D D19LP 190XTD 190XTLP 720 D21 220 7020 7030 7040 7045 3-7060 Projects: 3-U UC 2-G 2-B 2-C CA 7-WC RC WDLP WF D14 D21 210 7045 N7 |
Posted By: 2wise4agm
Date Posted: 05 Feb 2012 at 10:43am
|
The I&T manual was free with the tractor. Yeah, I probably should buy a better one. Anyway, checked my pressures at the ports on the valve and I only have 250 on the high and 250 on the low, but I still have pressure in neutral(about 40psi). Also, it takes a little bit for it to build to 250. When you shift from neutral it jumps right up to about 150, and then slowly climbs to 250. I'm thinking I should start by adding some shims to the relief, but the pressure in neutral and slow pressure build concerns me. Any thoughts? Thanks
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Posted By: stray
Date Posted: 05 Feb 2012 at 8:14pm
If you are getting 250 psi then it isn't your pressure reilef that reading is above the min. and it is just a spring and poppet valve. Have you checked these bushings any movement will cause problems ------------- 1969 190XT series 3 |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 05 Feb 2012 at 8:24pm
|
Disconnect the vertical rod coming from the console. Clamp a good pair of vise-grips to the crossshaft on that linkage and force the linkage to go full stroke high and low and verify the pressures then. |
Posted By: 2wise4agm
Date Posted: 06 Feb 2012 at 9:19pm
| My bushings seem fine.(that was the first thing I checked) But I disconnected the linkage and used a pair of vise grips on the cross-shaft, and my pressures are the same. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 06 Feb 2012 at 10:09pm
| Then remove the plug on top of the valve and begin adding shims to see if the pressure will raise to that 300 or so mark. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 06 Feb 2012 at 10:10pm
| That is 300 psi or so at half throttle or more. |
Posted By: 2wise4agm
Date Posted: 07 Feb 2012 at 6:09am
| Yeah. About 1600 rpm. It gets to 200 psi really fast, but takes about 10-15 seconds to build to 250. |
Posted By: 2wise4agm
Date Posted: 14 Feb 2012 at 10:27am
| Ok. Finally got around to shimming the relief this morning, and that did it. Although I did have to play around with the shims some. (The first time I had about 550 psi.) I do still have some pressure in neutral,(about 30-50 psi). Is this anything to be concerned with, or could it be just cold oil? It was about 30 degrees here this morn, and I only had the tractor running for about 45 minutes total. Thanks for the help guys. |
Posted By: Carl(NWWI)
Date Posted: 15 Mar 2012 at 9:17pm
| What's the problem if it moves in neutral, I just rebuilt my power director and it barely moves in high, low and neutral. Going to check pressures tomorrow. |
Posted By: stray
Date Posted: 15 Mar 2012 at 9:31pm
|
Here is the best place to check the pressures one port is for high and the other is low.  I have two hoses with gauges attach in the ports. 1/8" pipe plug ------------- 1969 190XT series 3 |
Posted By: Orange Blood
Date Posted: 15 Mar 2012 at 11:41pm
|
I will have to check the manual, but I am pretty sure you are suppose to read around 40-60psi in neutral. ------------- Still in use: HD7 WC C CA WD 2-WD45 WD45LP WD45D D14 3-D17 D17LP 2-D19D D19LP 190XTD 190XTLP 720 D21 220 7020 7030 7040 7045 3-7060 Projects: 3-U UC 2-G 2-B 2-C CA 7-WC RC WDLP WF D14 D21 210 7045 N7 |
Posted By: stray
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2012 at 5:00am
|
When I was working on mine last fall, it read zero in neutral on both gauges. The book also said that the minimum when engaged is 220 psi. ------------- 1969 190XT series 3 |
Posted By: overkill
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2012 at 6:57am
I have a copy of the factory manual and it tells and shows you to check it in front of the operators station also.
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Orange Blood wrote:Posted By: 2wise4agm
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2012 at 7:48am
| Hmmmm. |
Posted By: Carl(NWWI)
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2012 at 9:42am
| So how come the AC/AGCO manual says to check pressure at TEE fitting by steering consol, but everone here says to check it at the valve? And on that TEE fitting it says for high and low you should see 225-275 Psi and 60 psi in neutral. Whats the correct way to check it? |
Posted By: Carl(NWWI)
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2012 at 11:24am
|
ok, here are my pressures, On the Low side i have 90-130psi, the gauge bounces between the two, in high i have 70-110psi, with needle bouncing between, and in neutral i have 15 psi. Everytime i run it and i pull the dipstick i get a rush of air out of the hole, and when i pulled the plug for the high side a big rush of air came out of the valve. this was about 16-1800rpm. Thanks, Carl Update as of 2:45. Pulled out divider valve, seemed to be a little stiff/ stuck. Now I am reading 80psi in low, 60psi in high, and 0psi in neutral on both. if the gauges read 0 psi, then why does it still want to "drive" in neutral? update as of 5:10. checked pressures on TEE fitting, low side has 130psi, high side has 110psi, with needle bouncing around in both, and neutral has 30psi. when running is there supposed to be oil coming out of the releif line come from manifold?
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Posted By: stray
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2012 at 9:03pm
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I'm no expert on these power directors but I would add some shims to the relief valve that I showed in the picture above, and see if the pressures increase. I know every valve is differant, but 1 shim raised mine from 200 psi to 275 psi. Where are you checking pressures at? I know my manual said to check at the tee in front of the steering console, but every AC mechanic that I trust told me to check it at the valve. ------------- 1969 190XT series 3 |
Posted By: Carl(NWWI)
Date Posted: 16 Mar 2012 at 10:55pm
| Its says in above post..I checked both..doesn't make sense in raising valve pressure if my supply pssure isn't high enough to the pd valve? Or are they adjusted the same? |
Posted By: stray
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 6:15am
|
Think about it like this, if you have a hose with a gauge in it, running from the pump to the fill on the torque tube (hydrualic tank) it wouldn't show any pressure on the gauge becase there is no restriction. Pumps and relief valves don't make the pressure. The pump makes flow and relief valve controls the pressure. Restirctions is what makes the pressure. The power steering and the Power Director uses the same pump, and the steering I was told takes over 1100 psi to work. So if your power steerings working then you have the pressure you need to work the Power Director. So if your relief valve is passing oil at 130 psi you will never get the gauge at the tee above that, unless you are working the steering. When I was working on mine I was worried about the pressures being slightly differant, like yours, but when I got the relief valve shimmed right the two sided became the same. ------------- 1969 190XT series 3 |
Posted By: Carl(NWWI)
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 9:28am
|
Ok, that was what I was wondering, so, basically I need to shim up the relief valve on the pd valve. Should I just use lock washers? That's what my other valve had for shims. Thanks, Carl |
Posted By: stray
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 10:38am
|
If I remember right the flat washer is about the same as 3 or 4 shims. The shims are still avalible though Agco, don't quote me on this but I think somewhere in the area of $0.29 each. And 1 shim raised the pressure a lot more than I expected. ------------- 1969 190XT series 3 |
Posted By: Carl(NWWI)
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 10:42am
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Ok, I'll see what i can come up with. Thanks, Carl
|
Posted By: Carl(NWWI)
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 11:31am
| Well i added two shims (small washer and lock washer) and the pressures didnt even think about changing. |
Posted By: stray
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 1:01pm
|
Then I would say that you have a leak internally, I've not been in to that part resently enough to give advise. I know behind the valve there are a couple orings but I don't think it is very common to be the problem I would guess seals in the clutch itself have went bad. ------------- 1969 190XT series 3 |
Posted By: stray
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 1:03pm
|
You did check the bushings that are discussed above if bad the will allow the valve to not completely open. ------------- 1969 190XT series 3 |
Posted By: Carl(NWWI)
Date Posted: 17 Mar 2012 at 6:04pm
|
Well it was a classic case of me putting the pistons in the pd in backwards, pressure pushed em out, sealing rings popped out of the housing, which would bleed off all the pressure and not allow it to have neutral also, keeping a slight pressure on the plates because the pistons wouldnt retract. Carl |
Posted By: MACK
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 7:00am
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The reason the Allis manual says to check pressure at T is because the first valves were not tapped for check pluges then they didn't rewright the servise manual.
It is common to show some pressure in nutural. MACK
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Posted By: Carl(NWWI)
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 5:29pm
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Yeah, mine did have early valve on it, put a later one on though. Everything works now, my low side pressue is 150 and high is 130. Put a washer/shim in releif valve didnt change any. could it be the pump? Carl
|
Posted By: stray
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 9:09pm
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What is your power steering like? ------------- 1969 190XT series 3 |
Posted By: Carl(NWWI)
Date Posted: 18 Mar 2012 at 10:32pm
| Its a little jerky/ turn stop, turn stop...... Kinda stiff but nothing to bad. |