D 19 transplant with 5.9 Cummins?
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
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URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=43120
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Topic: D 19 transplant with 5.9 Cummins?
Posted By: DarrylinWA
Subject: D 19 transplant with 5.9 Cummins?
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 8:48pm
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I have been thinking way too much again, but after looking at the photos of transplant and other things, I was thinking of building after my 3 other projects a D 19 was the 5.9 cummins diesel. I have seen some real neat transplants at shows and some of the photos on here. My plan B would be a 440 Crysler in one because my dads first pulling tractor had a 440 in it and there is some sounds as I kid that I will not forget. Anyone seen a 5.9 in a tractor besides a Oliver ? In a Allis ? Just dreaming and have to much time on my hands again. at the oment. Take care Darryl in Wonder Land Krause ------------- B 10 Custom. Serial # 1001 D21, First D21 built 69 #4498 and Last D 21 Built #4609. 1946 MM UTU. And 2000, 2005 Pete's. AC custom Hauling. |
Replies:
Posted By: injpumpEd
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 8:50pm
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A 5.9L cummins in a D19 would be a really nice setup. Go easy on the power output though, the drivetrain will not like being worked real hard with lots of power on tap.
------------- 210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers! |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 01 Jan 2012 at 9:41pm
| The whole driveline (minus the final drives) is essentially the same as a D17 series 3......how much HP do you think it will stand ?? |
Posted By: DarrylinWA
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 12:33am
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I am just thinking of some minor tractor pulling And something different. Spend money on a good clutch and thats about it. I have a nice set of 23.1x34 rears either cast stock or 9 bolt rims. I know a 12 valve with not doing a whole lot could get 250 hp easy. ------------- B 10 Custom. Serial # 1001 D21, First D21 built 69 #4498 and Last D 21 Built #4609. 1946 MM UTU. And 2000, 2005 Pete's. AC custom Hauling. |
Posted By: MACK
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 8:15am
| I put a 5.9 in a 190xt for a guy. MACK |
Posted By: Doyle B(NY)
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 10:57am
| Do you have any pictures mack that would be pretty cool to see was there much modifinh to make it work? |
Posted By: PaulB
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 11:14am
| Just don't get crazy weighting it down real heavy. You can have a lot more fun going fast and light, then back on the trailer to pull another day. Those that weight down a tractor with lots of power spen more time in the shop than they do pulling. |
Posted By: Peterson
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 2:26pm
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I will be doing this swap into a 180. Im having a adapter plate made and a stock dodge flywheel turned down to work. Sould be pretty awesome when im done. Its goin to be a little brush puller. ------------- 7095-685I at 255hp, 8070-225HP,8050-210Hp,8030 with 155HP,220 with 670T engine with A-pump, 7580, 185 with 140HP, 2-6080's,6070, S4 D17,wd45,CA,st34 agco, S1 D17 with 3500MK2 |
Posted By: DaveCinIN
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 9:00pm
| I was wondering about putting a 5.9 into a 190XT. I know where I can get an early 5.9 and have a buddy with a machine shop. Like to see some pics. |
Posted By: TREVMAN
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 9:30pm
| Hate to rain on the parade, but a 5.9 in anyone of those tractors is TOO MUCH. You'll get really good at fixing transmissions and finals. I'd be looking at a 3.9 for a D-19, youd have lots of power. Stock non turbo 3.9s put out 80hp, with turbo, 110, 120, 130 hp ratings, and piles of torque. I would think it would be easier install as it is two cyls shorter as well, just mt 2 cents, Trev. |
Posted By: m16ty
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 9:34pm
I agree. Even the 130hp model would be enough to break things. |
TREVMAN wrote:Posted By: TREVMAN
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 9:49pm
| Just got to thinkin, and i dont know how hard they are to find, but keepin it Allis with a 433T out of an 6080 or a combine would be cool. I think the F II Gleaner used them. Basically its a 301 with 2 less cyls, I think they put out about 100hp, and as I remember, lots of torque, just an idea, but I think keeping it Allis would be a lot cooler, Trev. |
Posted By: MACK
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 10:15pm
| No, I didn't take any pictures. MACK |
Posted By: Peterson
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 10:56pm
Why would it be to much? The trans in these tractors are about the same size as the one in my dodge thats behind a 500 hp 5.9 It will be just fine. I also have a 140hp 301 in a 185 thats does farm work evey day at that power, also having a set of 18.4x34's too. You just need to know how to drive with that amount of power. O and the 5.9 is just a inch or so shorter then the 301. so it fits just fine. ------------- 7095-685I at 255hp, 8070-225HP,8050-210Hp,8030 with 155HP,220 with 670T engine with A-pump, 7580, 185 with 140HP, 2-6080's,6070, S4 D17,wd45,CA,st34 agco, S1 D17 with 3500MK2 |
Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 02 Jan 2012 at 11:17pm
| I would suggest a series III XT or at least make sure it's an XT with all the rear end updates. The D19 and early XT rear ends didn't handle 100 plus horsepower under load without problems. |
Posted By: Charlie (NC)
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 10:35am
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Peterson, Put some huge bull gears on the back of your Dodge truck and you'll start to understand. It's not so much about HP as it is about torque applied to the ground through the drive train. Engine torque times the final drive ratio gives you the torque applied to the ground in rough terms.
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Posted By: Peterson
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 11:29am
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ok so then what do the pullers do when they have a 1000-2000hp and who knows how much torque. For example the brabec brothers 180 (Country Dude) with the 301. they had tons of power with a set of 30.5x32's. and they never busted a thing that i know of. Show me a tractor that acually has busted or broke a bull gear or trans. ------------- 7095-685I at 255hp, 8070-225HP,8050-210Hp,8030 with 155HP,220 with 670T engine with A-pump, 7580, 185 with 140HP, 2-6080's,6070, S4 D17,wd45,CA,st34 agco, S1 D17 with 3500MK2 |
Posted By: Hurst
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 11:51am
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There's a couple things coming into play. Firstly, RPMs are very different. Pulling tractors are turning many more rpms than a field tractor at that HP. Also, what really kills drivetrains is low-speed torque, as this really puts a shock through the drivetrain (lugging the engine, it is not nearly as smooth torque application as at higher rpms). Secondly, pullers are running for very short moments of time. Steel parts will fatigue above a certain stress, but those short runs are probably not going to reach it for a while, but all day in the field will reach it pretty quickly. Think of farming with your tractor turned up the same as hauling a heavy load up a mountain grade with the truck turned up for a long time. If you did that, you would lose a ring and pinion, break an axle, lose a gear or two in the transmission, etc. Trucks see very intermittent loads compared to a farm tractor. Intermittent high loads can be put through components that would fail at this load for long periods of time. Hurst ------------- 1979 Allis Chalmers 7000 5800 Hours |
Posted By: injpumpEd
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 12:26pm
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Like Hurst stated, higher RPM = less torque. Also those tractors aren't as heavy and locked to the ground as a field tractor. And by the way, the're some guys/gals running 180's in superstock that have broken axle tubes, as well as gears. Wheel speed/spin helps save parts, as well as higher speed on gears doesn't let all the power pass through just one or two teeth at a time, it spreads out over more teeth. regardless, I wouldn't hesitate to put a 5.9 in a D19 just for fun. ------------- 210 "too hot to farm" puller, part of the "insane pumpkin posse". Owner of Guenther Heritage Diesel, specializing in fuel injection systems on heritage era tractors. stock rebuilds to all out pullers! |
Posted By: Charlie (NC)
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 1:12pm
| On top of what the others have said, when you see one of those 1000 hp super stock pullers don't make the assumption that anything in the gear train is stock. Plus they run those cut tires to allow the wheels to spin and keep from getting any chatter in the drivetrain. I don't know but I suspect the axles, gears, etc. in those rigs are made out of tougher stuff than stock and have probably been specially heat treated. I don't know much about big time pulling tractors but I also suspect that some of them run some sort of torque converter or multi-stage clutch so they can ease the power to the wheels without putting the full torque load to the ground right out of the hole. |
Posted By: Charlie (NC)
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 1:27pm
| I've actually been toying with the idea of putting an Olds 350 diesel in a D-14. I know the engine is a piece of junk but I have it and it's the DX block so it's some better than the original Olds diesels. I have a row crop D-14 with a busted block that has donated some parts to other projects and is just sitting there doing nothing. I figure why not try it. It will be interesting to see what breaks first. |
Posted By: KGood
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 1:42pm
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I intend on putting a 301 in my D19. I have everything but time and a good PD for it. I've never heard that D19 rearends were a problem. I see one guy pulls his in the 8000#class. |
Posted By: TREVMAN
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 5:46pm
| Put a big cam N14 in front of the tranny on your 8070, turn the pump to 400hp. Get yourself a 60 foot chisel plow, go plowing, see how long it lasts...The most detuned 5.9 will still be close to twice the hp and close to twice the torque of a stock d-19, which as pointed out, used the same running gear as a d-17. Comparing trucks to tractors is apples to oranges, pullers to farm tractors same deal. I wont buy a stock tractor if someone has messed with the pump. I see tractors advertised like a 7080 I saw a couple of days ago that said "Strong puller, dynoed at 210hp pto". Really, KEEP IT, not interested, not what it was designed to do. Trev. |
Posted By: RPSallispullinmd
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 6:54pm
| With me and my dad owning a Pro-stock JD pulling tractor you would be surprised at how the rear on our tractor has very few parts that resemble anything that JD put in there at their factory.On the Pro-stock level this has nothing to do with it being green either.Thanks! |
Posted By: victoryallis
Date Posted: 03 Jan 2012 at 7:38pm
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Ag repower repowered 6080s with a 3.9 cummins and alot of 6080s turned 100+ out of the factory. A 5.9 would be disaster in a 19 |