this bugs me decals on d17
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=23911
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Topic: this bugs me decals on d17
Posted By: D17 owner
Subject: this bugs me decals on d17
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2011 at 8:20pm
| What is the year break on the d17 sereies one from painting the decal on to a aluminum nameplate mine has the aluminum nameplate. I am gessing that this is a later sereies 1 by the SN it is a 61. Also the d17 sereies one, did they all have the "D17" on the side covers by the choke? Thats Eric |
Replies:
Posted By: Matt MN
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2011 at 9:11pm
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I believe you have a series 2 with the side name plates. post your serial number and we can tell you what you have ------------- Unless your are the lead horse the scenery never changes!! |
Posted By: Joe(OH)
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2011 at 10:05pm
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Remember, series 2 is "unofficial". If its after the black bars we, Allis people, call it a series 2. If you go to Agco most parts departments dont have a clue on what a series 2 D-17 is.
------------- Life is simpler when you plow around the stump. |
Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2011 at 10:22pm
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From my research these are the cosmetic changes during D17 production
D17 Series I (a) 1957 – 1959 Serial # 1001 to 23363
Persian orange: Mesh grill (orange), Wheels orange with silver rims, Black steering wheel, plain spokes Round muffler – silver, Air cleaner cap and tube silver, toolbox on right fender Black headlights mounted on radiator shell, black teardrop taillight on left fender Allis Chalmers in individual silver letters on hood, D17 in silver oval under fuel tank on side sheets D17 Series I (b) 1959 – 1960 Serial # 24001 to 31625 Persian orange: Mesh grill (silver) with black bar around it, Wheels orange with silver rims, Black steering wheel with molded spokes Round muffler – silver, Air cleaner cap and tube silver, toolbox on right fender Black headlights mounted on radiator shell, black teardrop taillight on left fender
Allis Chalmers in rectangular decal on hood, D17 in rectangular decal on lower rear of hood D17 Series II 1960 – 1962 Serial # 32001 to 41450 Persian orange #2: Vertical slotted grill (cream), Wheels cream with silver rims, Cream steering wheel with molded spokes Round muffler – silver, Air cleaner cap and tube silver, toolbox on right fender Black headlights mounted on radiator shell, black teardrop taillight on left fender Allis Chalmers in rectangular metal plate on hood, D17 in rectangular decal on lower rear of hood Silver metal overlay on the dash. D17 Series III 1963 – 1964 Serial # 65001 to 72768 Persian orange #2: Vertical slotted grill (cream), Wheels cream with silver rims, Cream steering wheel with molded spokes Oval muffler – black, Air cleaner cap and tube black, toolbox on right fender Black headlights mounted on fenders, black work / warning light on left fender Allis Chalmers in black letters on cream background w/black borders on decal full length of hood D17 on side of radiator and Series III on fuel tank (same decal as hood) Silver metal overlay on dash D17 Series IV 1964 – 1967 Serial # 75001 to 89213 Persian orange #2: Vertical slotted grill (cream), Wheels cream with silver rims, Cream steering wheel with molded spokes Oval muffler – black, Air cleaner cap and tube black, toolbox on left fender, hydraulic controls on right Black headlights mounted on fenders, black work / warning light on left fender Allis Chalmers in black letters on cream background w/black borders on decal full length of hood D17 on side of radiator and Series IV on fuel tank (same decal as hood) Silver metal overlay on dash I know this is overkill. I think this is accurate for farm tractors but any additions or corrections are welcome. |
Posted By: darrel in ND
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2011 at 10:38pm
| That is some good info, Dave. Very glad you posted it. Just hope I can find it again sometime down the road when I need it. Darrel |
Posted By: TedBuiskerN.IL.
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2011 at 10:48pm
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Excellent, except the slots in the cream grills are horizontal, and both of my series I D17's, a gas and a diesel had black tear drop tailights on both fenders. ------------- Most problems can be solved with the proper application of high explosives. |
Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2011 at 11:41pm
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There ya go! I meant horizontal, maybe I should have said the slots go across, LOL
As far as the tailights, most original D17 by now don't have any left, but even in AC advertising you can see D17's with tailights on both fenders and on only the left fender. I'm pretty sure the series II always had them on both fenders. I need to look at the owners & parts manuals again.
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Posted By: JC-WI
Date Posted: 11 Jan 2011 at 11:53pm
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Yup, black tear drop tail lights on both fenders. Wd & 45 had a smaller tailight on the left fender with real glass in it. But the D17 had bigger dia. ones with a plastic lense in them.
From the factory on the early D17, the head lights were on the sides of the radiator shell..but when a fellow put a loader on, they mounted the lights on a iron that went over the top of the hood and lot of the tractors never had their lights put back down onto the sides of the rad shell.
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Posted By: Dans 7080
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 12:05am
| I hope nobody looks at mine when I get it painted. Il just tape over the serial number. I like the looks of the series 3 paint and decals better so thats what my '59s gona get. Plus it will look better next to my D19. |
Posted By: sks72107
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 6:37am
| Oh man. this is some great info on the d17 differences. I am 99.99% sure mine is a series 1 by serial number if i read it correctly. The paint and decals on the other hand is a different story. I think mine is painted in persian 2, with cream wheels, and i think series 3 decals. The motor is now down for a rebuild and it is going to get repainted with persian 1. It may look odd until i can get the rest of the tractor painted, which will probably be several years down the road. I may scratch the paint off the serial # to make sure im not misreading it. o yea and my grill is also cream. |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 7:04am
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My brother painted his 58 like it should be with silver decals but then painted his 59 like a series II with cream wheels, grill and steering wheel and rectangular decals and to me there's no comparison in looks. The series II paint scheme looks sharp. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: TexasAllis
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 7:05am
You likely have an older restoration with factory decals. That was pretty common before aftermarket decals were available. The only decals available back in the day were from Allis and they were what ever the current series was at the time. My D17 is an S1 with S4 decals because that was all that was available.
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sks72107 wrote:Posted By: Dale Hardtke
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 8:23am
| Dave in il. Excellent information. You are a Allis Chalmers D-17 aficionado. This reminds me of an Allis Connection mtg. a few years back when groups of individuals competed against each other about D-17 information. Sure wished you were there on our team. |
Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 8:37am
The only problem is things like years and serial numbers I have to write down.
My memory recall seem to be a lot slower than it used to be, if you ask me a question I have an answer in a flash... usually while I'm sleeping that night or some time the next day LOL!
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Posted By: Mrbill69
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 9:09am
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Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 9:33am
Actually the Series I is not an "official" designation either. There is not any major mechanical changes untill the Series III came out although there were running changes.
Obviously the series II was a major change in the look of the D17 and many older tractors were repainted to match.
I've always wondered why AC designated the Series III as 3 when there were already three different looking versions that were basically the same tractor. In my mind it should have been either the Series II because of the mechanical changes as well as the dramatic change in looks, or the Series IV.
I've always liked the look of the original D17 with the oval D17 and individual letters on the hood. The Bar Grill looks cool but the fake nameplate decal always looked tacky to me. The series II is a really sharp looking tractor, no wonder most D17s got repainted to look like it. I've never met a D17 I didn't like but my Series IV (soon to be restored) is my very favorite.
Don't worry about the correct police though, it's your tractor and it should be the way YOU want it IMO. All my W series tractors are the "wrong color" (PO2) and if I see a D17 series 1 painted and decaled like a Series IV in doesn't bother me unless someone is trying to sell it as one.
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Posted By: TomYaz
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 10:07am
| I got a 59 with the bar grills....always thought that grill was bad-ass lookin. Mine had no grill but was lucky to find one in perfect condition to make it "correct".. |
Posted By: Ky.Allis
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 10:17am
| I don't think the Series 3 had the rear work light mounted on left fender. Mine is original and has work light mounted behind seat on it's own little bracket. I think the series 4 is when they put it on the left fender. I may be wrong---just my 2 cents worth |
Posted By: D17 owner
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 9:04pm
| I will have to look at my SN and get it on here. This is some good info on here. The thing that makes me think is the air cleaner also. Mine is orange as for the tail lights on the back. It dose not have any but you can see on both fenders where it looks like they have been ripped out yes I said it not unbolted and placed on the self but ripped out. I will also have to get pictures of the old gal and post to. Thanks for the brack down of all the series D17. Eric |
Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 10:48pm
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I double checked and will revise my resarch, horizontal slots on II, III & IV grills, two tailights on series I & II. It appears the series III is the first D17 to have a factory rear work light and it's mounted on a D19 type bracket behind the seat. Thanks, and keep coming up with stuff I've got wrong or missed.
Mrbill, it is possible your tractor air cleaner stack was painted orange at the factory, occasionally for what ever reason tractors left the factory with slight deviations in paint, orange parts that were usually black or visa versa. However I'd bet your grill has been repainted sometime in the 52 years since it left the factory LOL.
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Posted By: jrjuday
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 11:35pm
| Also, on all series, the hubs/hubcaps were painted same color as wheel discs. Lugnuts too. |
Posted By: jrjuday
Date Posted: 12 Jan 2011 at 11:46pm
| One other thing, the series 1 had the infamous butt killing steel pan seat! Mine got a series4 cushioned seat last summer. |
Posted By: Brian G. NY
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 8:41am
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Actually the Series I is not an "official" designation either. There is not any major mechanical changes untill the Series III came out although there were running changes.
[/QUOTE]
Well Dave, I always considered the full flow, high pressure oil system
using a common "spin-on" oil filter introduced with tractor # 24,001 as a fairly
"major" mechanical change.
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Posted By: Skyhighballoon(MO)
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 8:45am
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Dave - was just reading through the post to see if you caught that the worklight on the Series III was mounted to back hinge of the seat suspension. Series IV it moved to the left fender of course. Might also amend your notes to mention visors on the headlights when they were moved to the fenders in Series III. Other changes that are more appearance related that you might consider as well for your list for the Series IV is that the toolbox moved from the right to left fender to accommodate the hydraulic controls. Also the brake pedal foot pads were enlarged and a flip over bar added to lock the pedals together. Thanks for sharing! Mike ------------- 1981 Gleaner F2 Corn Plus w 13' flex 1968 Gleaner EIII w 10' & 330 1969 180 gas 1965 D17 S-IV gas 1963 D17 S-III gas 1956 WD45 gas NF PS 1956 All-Crop 66 Big Bin 303 wire baler, 716H, 712H mowers |
Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 9:46am
Yep, this bugs me too. I guess some guys think it's cool, but for me it ruins a nice paint job to see orange hubs peeking thru cream wheels, same with red hubs on Masseys with yellow wheels or Olivers... look's like they didn't take the time to finish LOL. That said I like the look of silver heads on the lugnuts even though it's not "factory"
AND as I said before, IT'S YOUR TRACTOR if you like orange hubs and creme wheels then thats the way they should be! I'll get over it LOL!
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Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 1:01pm
Well Dave, I always considered the full flow, high pressure oil system
using a common "spin-on" oil filter introduced with tractor # 24,001 as a fairly
"major" mechanical change. [/QUOTE]
Brian
I'm pretty sure the spin on oil filter was introduced on the Series III. My Series II serial# 32710 does not have it.
According to my parts book there were changes to the pump effective SN38500, but the pump is basically the same as previous high pressure low volume piston pumps. The Series IV introduced the high volume pump.
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Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 1:40pm
Not the bolts on the rear wheels and I think also the front wheels.
------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 1:41pm
I could be wrong but I think the cushioned seat like the later series was an option at least by 59. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 1:46pm
I'm pretty sure the spin on oil filter was introduced on the Series III. My Series II serial# 32710 does not have it.
According to my parts book there were changes to the pump effective SN38500, but the pump is basically the same as previous high pressure low volume piston pumps. The Series IV introduced the high volume pump. [/QUOTE]
Maybe your are each talking about a different filter, one being the engine oil filter and one for hydraulics which didn't come out until the Series III. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: Brian G. NY
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 2:47pm
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According to my parts manual, the pump, the filter base and the oil lines changed with tractor Serial #24001.
I have a Series "II" Serial #34633.
It runs 30 PSI oil pressure and I use the old Ford FL-1A spin on filters.
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Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 3:39pm
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Brian,
You are 100% right, I stand corrected. As Lonn said I was thinking hydraulics and I had a "senior moment" on the upgraded engine oil system.
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Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 4:38pm
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I said it Dave but somehow my quoting and statement got tangled so it was hard to decipher who said what. Anyway you understood it. I had to look at it a minute after I posted it. My line is at the bottom of the post. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: Brian G. NY
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 4:52pm
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Yep......I can see clearly now!
I'm talking engine oil, he's talking hydraulic oil.
Anyway, the change to the high pressure engine oil system was "significant", if not "major". LOL
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Posted By: D17 owner
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 7:55pm
| I just looked tonight at the sn 36,269. IT says it should have a cream steering wheel this one is black. Can someone post a picture of the d17 he sayed by the fuel tank. Ive only seen them in the frount (the newer ones) and on the side sheilds. Thanks Eric |
Posted By: Dave in il
Date Posted: 13 Jan 2011 at 9:30pm
Here is a nice Series II. I pulled it off of Tractor House I think
  It looks original, wish mine was that nice.
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Posted By: Allis dave
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2016 at 9:32am
| Searching through some old posts and founds this. Great info On D17 series cosmetic changes. Possible knowledgebase?? |
Posted By: ironac
Date Posted: 26 Sep 2016 at 1:42pm
| I've always considered the black bar d17s as a series 2 just because they they have more mechanical changes. A series 2 in my eyes has the wide drawbar, 4 bolt wide front, tall pto lever, and fancy steering wheel. Makes more sense then classifying by paint. |