Maroon belly 7000 oil leak from inspection plate
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=204307
Printed Date: 07 May 2025 at 1:57am
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Topic: Maroon belly 7000 oil leak from inspection plate
Posted By: RMA
Subject: Maroon belly 7000 oil leak from inspection plate
Date Posted: 26 Nov 2024 at 12:59pm
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Hello all, my 1st post here. Many this question has been answered, but I can't seem to find it. I have a AC 7000 maroon belly that works great. The issue I'm having is that once the pto is engaged, trans/hydraulic oil comes out of the front seal on transmission. The diff oil is lost and over fills the transmission compartment. I can use the tractor all day and not have any leak at all until I engage the pto and then ALOT of oil comes out and stops shortly after I disengage the pto. I'm not afraid of working on the tractor but have not had one split before. All help is appreciated, thank you. |
Replies:
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 26 Nov 2024 at 1:35pm
| When the PTO is engaged (hydraulic) oil comes out of the bellhousing, right behind the engine, correct ??? there is a metal plate that covers the bottom of the bellhousing. So, the hydraulic oil (sight glasses behind the batteries) goes DOWN when this leak occurs. I don't get why you are referring to the differential?? The oil level goes DOWN on that dipstick behind the cab??? and only when you are using the PTO ??? Somethings not right here. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 27 Nov 2024 at 8:10am
| When I engage the pto, oil goes from the differential compartment into the transmission which over fills and comes out the seal on the shaft that goes to the engine. I hope this makes sense. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 27 Nov 2024 at 8:12am
| The oil level on the dipstick behind the cab goes down, the site glasses behind the batteries goes up. |
Posted By: Alvin M
Date Posted: 27 Nov 2024 at 8:22am
| The trans and diff are the same compartment use the same dip stick hyd uses the sight glass on the right front |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 27 Nov 2024 at 8:28am
| Thanks for clarifying! So my hydraulic compartment is overfilling. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 27 Nov 2024 at 9:58am
| Such a strange problem. On the model 7000 tractor, the 4-speed transmission is the rearmost part of the hydraulic sump, which is the torque housing. There is an oil seal on the main shaft/pinion shaft of the transmission, keeping the differential oil (and 540/1000 PTO gears) in their own little compartment. So, there is a large lip seal on the pinion shaft and double seals on the lower PTO shaft up in the front of the transmission housing. The differential/PTO gears oil level is checked and added at the dipstick behind the cab. You CANNOT check that oil level with the PTO running. Engine should be OFF and tractor sitting on the level. There is a reverse idler shaft that could SEEP oil from diff to trans but it wouldn't be a fast transfer of oil I wouldn't think. An oil leak in the bellhousing when the PTO runs would require a split of rolling the engine away from the torque housing. I don't know why it only leaks when the PTO is engaged, but the PTO clutch is in that general area. I would be da&& sure to remove that belly cover and make it leak to see where the oil is coming from. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 27 Nov 2024 at 11:47am
| Thank you for the replies. I will try and get time this weekend to climb under and with the inspection plate removed, see exactly where it's coming from when the pto is engaged and give an update. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 27 Nov 2024 at 12:29pm
| That doesn't concern me as much as WHY the differential area is going down on fluid as you say. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 28 Nov 2024 at 12:13pm
 Not sure if the pic uploaded here or not (not very techy). I dried off all the oil before starting the tractor, let it idle a bit and brought the idle up to about 1000 rim and engaged pto (nothing connected). Almost immediately I had oil coming out from the shaft seal on the hydraulic side. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 28 Nov 2024 at 5:37pm
| I'm not doubting the oil leak inside the bell housing when the PTO is engaged. I am seriously questioning the complaint of the differential oil disappearing into the hydraulic sump. Never ever seen that and why are there two problems at the same time all of a sudden ??? |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 28 Nov 2024 at 6:10pm
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I bought the tractor knowing there was a leak. PO told from where it had been pouring from (inspection plate). He said he had hooked up to his haying equipment and noticed it pouring out, disconnected it and dragged it to the house and parked it. I brought it away and the mechanic said there was no leak. I picked it up and used it for 3 months (never engaged the pto as I had no need). Once pto is engaged the rear oil seems to be flowing into the hydraulic tank, overfilling and then coming out the shaft seal. Pretty much no leaks anywhere else on this tractor. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 28 Nov 2024 at 8:50pm
| Well, this is where I have a problem trying to diagnose this accurately. I am having a very hard time believing that oil is disappearing from the differential area to the hydraulic sump in a fast manner. I've also never had a leak in the bell housing area like that ONLY when the PTO was operating. Not saying it isn't leaking, just questioning why it's leaking. Are you SURE the hydraulic system is really OVERFULL?? Like truly above the upper sight glass ?? |
Posted By: DougG
Date Posted: 29 Nov 2024 at 6:19am
| Could something be creating pressure back there; not familiar with these; just thinking out loud a little |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 29 Nov 2024 at 6:35am
| The vent on the differential compartment is built in to the dipstick handle. If it was plugged it would take heat to push oil forward and that would take time to make the heat, so I don't think so, at this point. I asked and never got an answer: The differential oil level must be checked with the tractor sitting on the level and engine AND PTO OFF !! That oil level cannot be checked with the engine running and PTO engaged as the 540/1000 RPM PTO gears are churning the oil inside the differential area. I see no way how checking the oil under that scenario would yield an accurate reading. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 29 Nov 2024 at 12:47pm
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Sorry for the late reply! I'm not getting notifications when someone replies. The oil is always checked with engine off and tractor level. I wiped everything off again and put the cover plate on. Used the tractor to put a round baler in the feeder (forgot to mention the PO put an Allied loader on it). Tractor prob idled outside the shop for a few hrs while I was moving stuff around in said shop to bring the tractor back in. Inspection plate and bolts are completely dry. I did remember today to take the diff vents off and they were solid plugged. Cleaned them real good and air easily passes through now. As far as the hydraulic compartment checking to see if its overfilling, not sure how I would check that. The site glasses are completely full and the shaft is what runs through there, correct? Thanks again for your time. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 29 Nov 2024 at 12:51pm
 These are the 2 vents on the top plate of the rear diff. The rear dipstick does not have a vent on my tractor. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 29 Nov 2024 at 1:36pm
| The two vents you cleaned are to the right and left bull gear compartment. As I said, the breather for the CENTER compartment (differential and PTO gears) is built into the dipstick handle. You could remove the top sight glass and let the oil run out, but that usually means you'll need a new sight glass as they will break when removed. Drain oil out of the pan directly down from the sight glasses one gallon at a time until you can see thru the top sight glass. How much oil have you added to the differential compartment ?? |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 29 Nov 2024 at 2:08pm
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I see! Thanks for the clarification. I've added about 2 liters in the back and that's about what came out of the front. I'll empty some as you say and see if it fills up. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2024 at 12:51pm
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Ok! Update on oil leak. Used the tractor to put a bale in the feeder (drained about 3/4 gallon out of the hydraulic "tank" so top site glass was pretty much empty prior to starting it). Before parking the tractor I turned the pto on for about 5 seconds and oil started coming out the inspection plate right away. The hydraulic "tank" did not seem to increase is fluid level at all, but my read diff tank lost about an 1/8" on the dipstick. Any ideas? |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2024 at 1:02pm
| Tractor has to be split, separating the engine from the bellhousing. Disassemble the PTO hollow shaft and see what's going on. It is related to the PTO clutch and it is in that area that you'll be working. I'm thinking the foot clutch may be oil soaked after all of this. New clutch and pressure plate and throwout brg and pilot bearing and rear crank seal/sleeve and both input shaft seals and gaskets. AND, try and figure out why the leak is coming from the area it's coming from. Might have to air check/test the PTO clutch while apart to see what's happening. |
Posted By: tbran
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2024 at 1:45pm
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If I may, and this is from an OLD memory bank, seems we had one do the same thing. I think, and again this is fuzzy, but this is not like the 190 and others with the 2 back to back seals in the belly - but one seal that may run on a bushing that fits on the intermittent shaft. Either the shaft was bent or the bushing spun but when the shaft spun it would push oil from the rear to the front compartment as the shaft spun. We had to split the tractor and replace the seal and bushing. As Doc has stated I can't see any connection other than the bottom seal on the PTO shaft . To the best of my recollection the rear compartment is a bit higher than the hyd / trans side. Any other seal leak will push oil from the front to the rear... As to the leak on the input - this is not uncommon on these older units... Will have to be split again to repair as in putting in a dry foot clutch. ------------- When told "it's not the money,it's the principle", remember, it's always the money.. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2024 at 4:56pm
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Thank you all for your patience with me and for your wisdom. One thing I noticed was that today I heard a rattle when the pto was engaged. Not sure that was because the hydraulic tank was lower on oil? I will look into splitting the tractor. Not afraid of getting my hands dirty, but I am afraid of flipping the tractor as I've never split one before. |
Posted By: Allis dave
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2024 at 5:49pm
It's a good time to build yourself some splitting stands. I"m sure osme on here have some pictures to share if you need some ideas. Here's some on my 185 |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 04 Dec 2024 at 6:02pm
| The "rattle" when the PTO is running is when the engine speed is under say 1200 RPM and is very NORMAL, so don't go thinking there's some else wrong. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2024 at 10:46am
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Good to know! Which part do I have to split to get at the pto seal? I have a cab on my tractor. Thanks again! |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2024 at 10:52am
| Split the engine away from the bellhousing. Fix the massive leak that is going on the ground. If there is an "oil transferring" problem from the differential to the hydraulic system, fix that after the fact. Prove that you do have an oil transfer problem. 1/8" of an inch isn't a convincing problem. 2 inches would be. |
Posted By: tbran
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2024 at 12:33pm
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Don't know if the link will work, but you will need 70931030 seal,70242504 bushing, 70931031 seal and 70924143 oring at least. https://na.epsilon1.agcocorp.com/p/agcoallis/79003886/l/152?tocGuid=d849a737-e408-9564-a8da-1e5352d03cae" rel="nofollow - https://na.epsilon1.agcocorp.com/p/agcoallis/79003886/l/152?tocGuid=d849a737-e408-9564-a8da-1e5352d03cae ------------- When told "it's not the money,it's the principle", remember, it's always the money.. |
Posted By: Hurst
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2024 at 12:40pm
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My black belly seems to do the same thing when the PTO is on, and I have tried multiple front input shaft seals with no long term success. I'm interested in what you find. Granted they are quite a bit different design in regards to the input shaft, with the black belly having a solid shaft, but I do believe there may be something going on in the PTO clutch that is causing oil to be forced past the seal. Best, Hurst ------------- 1979 Allis Chalmers 7000 5800 Hours |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2024 at 11:34pm
| I lost about an 1/8" on the dipstick in about 5 seconds of pto run time. That sounds like alot to me? I will def take my time and I have a heavy duty mechanic friend (works at a Case dealership) who said he would give me a hand. Not sure when I will get to it, but I will def keep everyone posted in what I find. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 06 Dec 2024 at 11:36pm
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Thank you! I bought the service manuals and the parts manual (kit came with 4 different e-books?) |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 07 Dec 2024 at 6:42am
| Regardless. You must stop the external leak first. Then, move on to determining if and how bad a possible oil transfer problem really is. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 09 Dec 2024 at 12:56pm
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Hey guys, Not sure if I need to start a different thread? But my 3pth won't go down when I have the tractor in higher rims. It raises great, but lowering down requires lower rpm. This will be an issue once I fix the pto problem as the snowblower won't stay on the ground. I've already played around with the traction boost levers but it still does it. Thanks again! |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 09 Dec 2024 at 1:29pm
| Pretty much sounds normal to me. If you've got 500 lbs hanging on it, I'll bet it works fine. Cold hyd oil causes what you are complaining about. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 10 Dec 2024 at 10:04am
| I've got an 8' dual auger Farmking snowblower on it that I can't keep on the ground. I realize it doesn't matter much without being able to use the snowblower until the pto issue is fixed, but figured if it was something internal then I could take care of it while it was split. Thanks again for your responses! |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 10 Dec 2024 at 11:29am
| The two rear levers on the console must be clear rearward. |
Posted By: RMA
Date Posted: 11 Dec 2024 at 9:00am
| Thanks, I'll take a look and see where they're positioned. |