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Dangerous Towing idiots

Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Other Topics
Forum Name: Shops, Barns, Varmints, and Trucks
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URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=201089
Printed Date: 07 Jun 2024 at 2:27pm
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Topic: Dangerous Towing idiots
Posted By: DMiller
Subject: Dangerous Towing idiots
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2024 at 6:46pm
This was on a different forum DIYDave and I write on




Replies:
Posted By: PaulB
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2024 at 7:39pm
Just wait until another idiot pulls across his lane and waits for traffic in the other lane to clearWackoWackoWacko
https://youtu.be/mZV2RyywldY?si=VOPvZo2rErcFmxzY


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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY


Posted By: Lars(wi)
Date Posted: 28 Apr 2024 at 7:56pm
Originally posted by DMiller DMiller wrote:

This was on a different forum DIYDave and I write on


iRV2 ?

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I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.


Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2024 at 4:20am
Equipment forum


Posted By: Ted J
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2024 at 5:35am
Think this was just a stunt??  Just to get a pic?

NOBODY can be THAT dumb can they?


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"Allis-Express"
19?? WC / 1941 C / 1952 CA / 1956 WD45 / 1957 WD45 / 1958 D-17


Posted By: jaybmiller
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2024 at 6:40am
sure they can...
google 'burlington skyway bridge accident' , find the one where the dump trailer  hit the bridge with the trailer UP !!!


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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)

Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water


Posted By: thendrix
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2024 at 3:35pm
While it is dumb and dangerous, I'm kinda impressed

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"Farming is a business that makes a Las Vegas craps table look like a regular paycheck" Ronald Reagan


Posted By: jaybmiller
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2024 at 3:59pm
It's illegal for non-commercial drivers to tow more than one trailer here in Ontario.
That 'rig' would count as THREE trailers if the 5th wheel dolly is a 'trailer'...


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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)

Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water


Posted By: Lars(wi)
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2024 at 4:17pm
Originally posted by jaybmiller jaybmiller wrote:

It's illegal for non-commercial drivers to tow more than one trailer here in Ontario.
That 'rig' would count as THREE trailers if the 5th wheel dolly is a 'trailer'...

I don’t believe here in the states, that 5th wheel dolly is considered a separate trailer. If it was than many freight companies that ‘pulled doubles’ would have necessitated their drivers to have ‘triples’ endorsement on CDL’s.

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I tried to follow the science, but it was not there. I then followed the money, and that’s where I found the science.


Posted By: 55allis
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2024 at 7:19pm
Would like to watch him turn around when he gets lost…

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1955 AC WD45 diesel with D262 repower, 1949 AC WD45


Posted By: steve(ill)
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2024 at 7:58pm
I would like to see them LOAD the BOAT..

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Like them all, but love the "B"s.


Posted By: jaybmiller
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2024 at 8:58pm
easy, custom ramps off the tailgate area, electric winch to lower the trailer with boat.


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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)

Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water


Posted By: KJCHRIS
Date Posted: 29 Apr 2024 at 11:39pm
I Haven't seen that combo before. 
 I've seen pickups pulling camper, pulling a large boat on I-29 between Omaha, Ne and Sioux City heading for the Iowa lakes or the reservoirs on Missouri River in S. D.  
 And in July & August you see the pickups pulling camper and a trailer loaded with motorcycles on behind on I-29.  Expensive outfits; figuring an over $100,000 pickup, over $100,000 camper, $15,000 trailer and 4 x $40,000 bikes. Over $350,000 in vacation toys. 



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AC 200, CAH, AC185D bareback, AC 180D bareback, D17 III, WF. D17 Blackbar grill, NF. D15 SFW. Case 1175 CAH, Bobcat 543B,


Posted By: DiyDave
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2024 at 4:08am
https://youtu.be/mZV2RyywldY?si=VOPvZo2rErcFmxzY" rel="nofollow - https://youtu.be/mZV2RyywldY?si=VOPvZo2rErcFmxzY

Pau''s link...


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Source: Babylon Bee. Sponsored by BRAWNDO, its got what you need!


Posted By: truckerfarmer
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2024 at 5:32am
Originally posted by Lars(wi) Lars(wi) wrote:

Originally posted by jaybmiller jaybmiller wrote:

It's illegal for non-commercial drivers to tow more than one trailer here in Ontario.
That 'rig' would count as THREE trailers if the 5th wheel dolly is a 'trailer'...

I don’t believe here in the states, that 5th wheel dolly is considered a separate trailer. If it was than many freight companies that ‘pulled doubles’ would have necessitated their drivers to have ‘triples’ endorsement on CDL’s.

Not sure about other states, but here my endorsement says doubles/triples.

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Looking at the past to see the future.
'53 WD, '53 WD45, WD snap coupler field cultivator, #53 plow,'53 HD5B dozer

Duct tape.... Can't fix stupidity. But will muffle the sound of it!


Posted By: PaulB
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2024 at 6:46am
Originally posted by Ted J Ted J wrote:

NOBODY can be THAT dumb can they?

Unfortunately So many people will now take that as a challenge.

I know of someone here locally that was going to Florida to ride his motorcycle. Instead of riding the motorcycle and having a nice trip, he hitched his 4 door pickup pulling his 20' enclosed trailer behind his tour-bus sized motorhome. total length was nearly 100' and because it was a RV he wasn't required to go into any scale houses or DOT safety checks. Only the motorhome had working brakes in this setup.  ANYONE driving an RV should be required to have an endorsement on their license for the size of the RV. Also anyone pulling a trailer should also need a trailer endorsement.
  Maybe this is what we get for trying to make cars idiot proof with all the thigs cars have nowadays instead of just being a car. 


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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY


Posted By: jaybmiller
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2024 at 7:04am
skechy report but in Texas, someone decide to pass a 'superload' (160 TON pipe) on the shoulder. he lost.

BTW up here, anyone with basic license can drive a 'school bus',modeified for just 4 seats and no sign on it !!!


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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)

Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water


Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2024 at 7:15am
That's actually a legal load.  Driver will need a Class A CDL, and in most states, an endorsement for doubles and triples.

Let's break it down:

First off, the Gross Combined Weight of the tow vehicle (tractor) must not be exceeded, and Gross Axle Weight Ratings must also be respected. That appears to be an F450... but COULD be an F550.  My F450's were typically 18,000gvw, with 6000lb steer and 13,000lb drive.  Without the (heavy) service body, my chassis wet weight was 8300lbs.  With the 9'x12' service body EMPTY, that went to 10700, and with all my tools and equipment, it was 15,200.  THIS Truck's GVW is certainly not exceeded with that factory pickup box (they're only about 900lbs) boat on top, that fish'n ski only weighs about 2100lbs dry (tandem axles are for durability when running with water in the baitwells).

The dolly accepts a significant amount of the 5th wheel's nose weight.  The camper has tandem singles, they're clearly nothing exotic... the 'standard' largest axle capacity common to campers is 8 on 6-1/2" bolt pattern 7,000lb, and trailer tires commonly match this.  Two 7000lb axles, plus 10% on the nose comes to 7+7+1.4=15,400lb GVW for the trailer... and probably under 1000lbs for the dolly assembly... so 16400 if it's fully loaded.

The enclosed trailer at the back appears to have 5-bolt axles, which  puts them in around the 3500lb class... so that trailer will be in the 3500+3500+10% = 8000lb GVW range.

So let's say the Tractor's GVW (not it's loaded weight) is 16,000, TOWED stock comes to 16,400 + 8000, for Gross Combined Weight of only 24416.

The pickup's Gross Combined rating ('towing capacity') is upwards of 28-30,000lbs.

As long as all axles have brakes (in this case, electric), all lights work properly, the total length, height, and width combination is within the driver's CDL endorsement, this is legal, and there's towing capacity to spare.

A bit extreme for some?  perhaps.  Dangerous?  Certainly not when done properly, by experienced professionals.

Would I do it?  No... but that doesn't make it idiotic, and I would know-  I'm a well-experienced  and versatile idiot.




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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.


Posted By: PaulB
Date Posted: 30 Apr 2024 at 9:51am
As it's an RV anyone with a car license could drive that rig in the U.S. as RVs don't need to adhere to DOT rules as to driver requirements. Now the tow vehicle if OVER 10,000 pounds  (as built) GVW and possibly the camper is required to have an annual FMVSA  inspection.  As for the many safety violations possible to hitching and brake function, it may take a cop the best part of a day to figure it out. Most will just look the other way and hope that they don't need to respond to an accident involving that rig in their area during their shift. 
   This is why I've retired from daily commercial driving and limit my highway travels otherwise. No one seems to have any common sense or courtesy any more. 


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If it was fun to pull in LOW gear, I could have a John Deere.
If you can't make it GO... make it SHINY


Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 01 May 2024 at 5:45pm
As to Truck Sizing, this is Not a F450 or 550, they do NOT come with Dually Beds, chassis is not designed to accommodate one but to have a Aftermarket bed either Tool or Flat installed.  450/550 uses 19.5 Ten lug not Eight wheels and tires, suspension is functionally different from the 350 line.   This is a F350 Crew Cab GWVR is not what has been expressed as Towing is based on a Empty Truck not with a Boat on top.  This Combination is so beyond sane as to appear absolutely nuts.


Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 03 May 2024 at 12:44am
There's insufficient clarity of the photos posted to determine the lug nut count or tire size, but I know my F450 service trucks well... my team's fleet consisted of 8 F450's starting with 2003, all the way up to 2019... and yes, one COULD get an F450 with a pickup body, as we changed out our entire fleet every two years, or after ONE of the trucks hit 100,000mi.  After we removed our service bodies, our F450's were fitted with dually pickup bodies and sold to construction contractors and RV'ers.

From these photos, it's clear it's a Crew Cab, and a DRW.  Let's assume it IS an F350, and while I don't know the year, most of the specs don't change much year-to-year (except the introduction of the aluminum body, which reduced tare, thus yielding a higher capacity at same GVWR).  As an example, I looked up the 2019 specs sheet, which lists the F350 Crew Cab as a 14,000gvwr truck, and advertises it's payload capacity as 6550 (for the 4wd) and 6970lbs (Rwd)... the difference clearly being that the 4wd version had an extra 450lbs or so of driveline to lug around.  That boat weighs under 2100lbs, so there's a whole lot of load room left.

Towing capacity is expressed in Gross Combined Weight, and nothing else.  It doesn't matter if the entirety of the load is in draft, or distributed to the vehicle, it is part of the full combination.  In a 5th wheel application, a significant portion of the load is borne upon the tow vehicle, just like a semi-tractor, and when that hitch is placed slightly forward of the rear axle, the towed load is proportioned onto the front, as well as rear axle.  When a bumper hitch is used, the tongue load bears well BEHIND the drive axle, and the result is a higher axle load than the actual tongue load (because it is now an overhanging load) and also, the steer axle is reduced... lifted up.

In the case of this setup, the 5th wheel dolly acts just like a heavy-haul 'booster', carrying a significant amount of tongue load, but keeping a little on the hitch to assure stable tracking.

Gross Combined Weight Rating for the F350 goes all the way up to 31,300lbs.  There's no reason to suspect this rig exceeds the truck's GCWR.

It is a legal configuration in many states, and I've weighed plenty of them.


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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.


Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 03 May 2024 at 4:10am
Go ahead and accept the minimal game, I do not, will not. Truck is a rolling dumpster fire looking for a reason to destroy itself and much more. If need all that ‘stuff’ and have the money to afford can take a flight rent a car and stay at a Five Star Cheaper. Do the math, it is pretty simple. As to campgrounds, list the ones that will accept that mass of garbage, fewer than 250 nationwide as have been explained and costs reflect unavailability.    

Have fun .


Posted By: Tbone95
Date Posted: 03 May 2024 at 7:22am
I just wanna know how high the bow of the boat is.


Posted By: ACFarmer
Date Posted: 03 May 2024 at 8:56am
Originally posted by DMiller DMiller wrote:

As to Truck Sizing, this is Not a F450 or 550, they do NOT come with Dually Beds, chassis is not designed to accommodate one but to have a Aftermarket bed either Tool or Flat installed.  450/550 uses 19.5 Ten lug not Eight wheels and tires, suspension is functionally different from the 350 line.   This is a F350 Crew Cab GWVR is not what has been expressed as Towing is based on a Empty Truck not with a Boat on top.  This Combination is so beyond sane as to appear absolutely nuts.

They sure do make F450 pick up trucks. Bought one brand new in 2010 and theres a 2017 sitting in my driveway right now. The truck in the picture has 19.5's on it as well.


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Making A living everyday farming with and working on Allis Equipment


Posted By: jaybmiller
Date Posted: 03 May 2024 at 10:33am
re: just wanna know how high the bow of the boat is.

Hopefully less than 13'6" if in Ontario !!!!


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3 D-14s,A-C forklift, B-112
Kubota BX23S lil' TOOT( The Other Orange Tractor)

Never burn your bridges, unless you can walk on water


Posted By: DaveKamp
Date Posted: 06 May 2024 at 7:31am
Originally posted by Tbone95 Tbone95 wrote:

I just wanna know how high the bow of the boat is.


That's a valid concern-  based on the angles of those two photos, it looks to be mebbie a couple inches higher than the top of the RV.  If there's an AC unit, open vent, or TV antenna atop the RV, then they're about the same height.


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Ten Amendments, Ten Commandments, and one Golden Rule solve most every problem. Citrus hand-cleaner with Pumice does the rest.


Posted By: DiyDave
Date Posted: 06 May 2024 at 3:31pm
He's got room enough on top of the motorhome, to haul a crane, to get the boat down...Wink

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Source: Babylon Bee. Sponsored by BRAWNDO, its got what you need!


Posted By: Walker
Date Posted: 06 May 2024 at 7:42pm
Originally posted by jaybmiller jaybmiller wrote:

re: just wanna know how high the bow of the boat is.

Hopefully less than 13'6" if in Ontario !!!!
             Or less depending on how many repeated pothole patchings or layers of asphalt without dressing down first have been applied. Twenty years or so ago going into Kent Ohio was an underpass that made ya want to lay your head on the steering wheel and cross your arms over it with a sign happily proclaiming 13'6".


Posted By: BuckSkin
Date Posted: 07 May 2024 at 11:39am
Originally posted by DMiller DMiller wrote:

This was on a different forum DIYDave and I write on


I see that all the time on the Parkway.

That is more than likely a professional delivery guy for a big camper and boat sales company.

It is definitely not just some consumer individual trying to get attention.

I see them quite often with a boat/trailer loaded thus and three trailers in tow, either camper trailers or boat trailers or a mix.

I have been asked several times to bring my F350 and join them, but I had much rather do my long-hauling in a big truck, W900 or 379.

That is not to say that, if funds were low and things were tight, I wouldn't hook up and go.


Posted By: BuckSkin
Date Posted: 07 May 2024 at 11:53am
Originally posted by truckerfarmer truckerfarmer wrote:

Originally posted by Lars(wi) Lars(wi) wrote:

Originally posted by jaybmiller jaybmiller wrote:

It's illegal for non-commercial drivers to tow more than one trailer here in Ontario.
That 'rig' would count as THREE trailers if the 5th wheel dolly is a 'trailer'...

I don’t believe here in the states, that 5th wheel dolly is considered a separate trailer. If it was than many freight companies that ‘pulled doubles’ would have necessitated their drivers to have ‘triples’ endorsement on CDL’s.

Not sure about other states, but here my endorsement says doubles/triples.

Likewise with my Class A; there is no differentiation between doubles and triples; if you qualify for one, you qualify for both; I believe the endorsement is either "N" or "T" ; I have both N and T; I think the "N" is "Numerous" meaning doubles/triples and the "T" means Tanker.


Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 07 May 2024 at 11:54am
Hot Shot trucking, had its day in midwest and west, rules broken, fines levied, equipment towed or impounded. All as failed to DOT license, gain correct permits and registrations, attain commercial insurance for commercial use. Sad but the mess these types made over last few years is clearing many off the roadways.

Mo DOT Inspectors are bo longer turning a blind eye, same in CO, WY, NM, AZ, OK and AR. Heard IA is breaking nee revenues against these people as is IL.


Posted By: truckerfarmer
Date Posted: 07 May 2024 at 8:09pm
Originally posted by BuckSkin BuckSkin wrote:

Originally posted by truckerfarmer truckerfarmer wrote:

Originally posted by Lars(wi) Lars(wi) wrote:

Originally posted by jaybmiller jaybmiller wrote:

It's illegal for non-commercial drivers to tow more than one trailer here in Ontario.
That 'rig' would count as THREE trailers if the 5th wheel dolly is a 'trailer'...

I don’t believe here in the states, that 5th wheel dolly is considered a separate trailer. If it was than many freight companies that ‘pulled doubles’ would have necessitated their drivers to have ‘triples’ endorsement on CDL’s.

Not sure about other states, but here my endorsement says doubles/triples.


Likewise with my Class A; there is no differentiation between doubles and triples; if you qualify for one, you qualify for both; I believe the endorsement is either "N" or "T" ; I have both N and T; I think the "N" is "Numerous" meaning doubles/triples and the "T" means Tanker.


Mine are TX. I have everything but schoolbus.


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Looking at the past to see the future.
'53 WD, '53 WD45, WD snap coupler field cultivator, #53 plow,'53 HD5B dozer

Duct tape.... Can't fix stupidity. But will muffle the sound of it!


Posted By: Coke-in-MN
Date Posted: 08 May 2024 at 12:55pm
The tow dolly would be licensed to weight it carries of camper . 
The truck is not a RV but tow vehicle so depending on load scaled by truck and load may require a Annual DOT inspection sticker as over 10,001 weight . 
 To make a legal RV I have seen motor homes pulling doubles , car hauling trailer loaded with vehicle and a boat on trailer attached to that trailer .
 Depending on hitch type a 10% load transfer is possible with bumper type hitch ball but with fifth wheels or pentle hook device up to 20% load can be carried . 
 Like any DOT inspection each unit would require it's own type of inspection , and the weak point might be the tow dolly weight limit . 
  By using a RV as power source it changes the legality of full unit and if any special drivers license is needed beyond a Class D passenger vehicle license . 
 The trailer of any combination even under 24 or 26,000  in which the trailer is over 10,001 requires the tow vehicle and the trailer to be DOT inspected 

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Faith isn't a jump in the dark. It is a walk in the light. Faith is not guessing; it is knowing something.
"Challenges are what make life interesting; overcoming them is what makes life meaningful."


Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 08 May 2024 at 1:16pm
Still have my Class A, dropped HAZMAT and Bus, but kept Multiple Trailer on it.  IF no brakes on Dolly it would be Illegal for Use as Every Axle on the Ground in certain considerations MUST be Brake Equipped on GVW Ratings.  If Home Made as I have not seen a Corporate Build Fifth Wheel Towing Dolly, it will require Legal Aspect assurances beyond a Insurance Policy.  Went thru that with a Home Made Dropneck Lowboy we built in the 1980s.


Posted By: DMiller
Date Posted: 08 May 2024 at 1:24pm
So I researched and Yes there are Legal Tow Dollies, HOWEVER, Read the informations page, waffling to a point of Conjecture as to Vehicle Legal length presentation, Requirement to License NA and other subject to States Interpretations is pretty far out there.

https://fifthwheelst.com/automated-safety-hitch-system.html" rel="nofollow - Automated Safety Hitch System Review (fifthwheelst.com)


Posted By: Tbone95
Date Posted: 09 May 2024 at 8:16am
Originally posted by DaveKamp DaveKamp wrote:

Originally posted by Tbone95 Tbone95 wrote:

I just wanna know how high the bow of the boat is.


That's a valid concern-  based on the angles of those two photos, it looks to be mebbie a couple inches higher than the top of the RV.  If there's an AC unit, open vent, or TV antenna atop the RV, then they're about the same height.

Looks like more than a couple inches to me, but obviously we can’t say for sure.



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