New Super Series Gleaner combine
Printed From: Unofficial Allis
Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=16460
Printed Date: 05 Jun 2024 at 11:17pm
Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 11.10 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: New Super Series Gleaner combine
Posted By: AndrewGubbels
Subject: New Super Series Gleaner combine
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 10:45pm
Hey guys I just got back from service training and Launch on the new combines. I did not get a chance to take any photos at the launch but at the training I got some good shots of the combine in the training area. This one does not have the new updated 380 bushel grain tank extensions.  New look to the decals and shields on the combine. Everything moves and removes just excellent.  New 30" Diameter rotor. it went from 4350 square inches cleaning to 6050 square inches of cleaning.  New SCR engine. This creates 398 peak opperating hp. This will use the DEF fluid.  New radiator with bigger opening slots to flow more air through to bring the small dust right on through. Along with the flipper and dual flippers over the oil cooler.  More new styling. I think this is awesome.  New 4 section concave that is wider also. SO more threshing area.  More auger on the distribution augers along with bigger diameter accelerator rollers. Along with this they have the bigger drive gears on the side of the combine.  One more shot of the side of the combine. ALso Some other changes I did not get a photo of are it does have a double v belt on the chopper drive now. One other thing I really like is to remove the top drive shaft for the rear fead chain you do not have to remove the sprockets!! THey put a removable plate. This will be great for working on the machine. There are many other improvements that have been developed over the past couple of years on the r76 and r66 that were made for this combine. ------------- Andrew Gubbels Gubbels Restoration |
Replies:
Posted By: morton(pa)
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 11:26pm
|
I'm sorry, but I can't help but notice RED where ORANGE used to be on the Gleaner Combines. I saw one of those new Hesston bailers painted Red with AGCO on the side of it earlier this week...I felt like I was going to be sick. Other then that, it looks like a GREAT combine, at least from the outside. I can't vouch for much with the pictures of the inside cause I haven't the slightest clue the difference in 1 from the next!
|
Posted By: Bill_MN
Date Posted: 11 Aug 2010 at 11:34pm
|
i like the old-style gleaner logo above the windshield, kind of like the real old gleaner-baldwin era machines, a neat touch ------------- 1951 WD #78283, 1918 Case 28x50 Thresher #76738, Case Centennial B 2x16 Plow |
Posted By: JohnCO
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 12:14am
|
Wow, quite a machine. 11 ton grain bin capacity, wow!
------------- "If at first you don't succeed, get a bigger hammer" Allis Express participant |
Posted By: darrel in ND
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 2:33am
| Thanks for posting the pictures, Andrew. I am really looking forward to seeing the machine in action. I worked on Gleaners for 14 years (1986-2000), and have a great appreciation for them. Darrel |
Posted By: MI8050
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 4:33am
| That looks like a sweet rig Andrew. What does "Tritura" mean? I'm referring to whatever that word is right above and ahead of the unloading auger....I like the old Gleaner logo on the cab too, thats cool, old meets new. I like the paint scheme, it looks fresh. As much as I hate to see the orange fading from AGCO on the Gleaner machine, one must recall that AC bought the brand at one time and put their touches on it too. I am glad to see that AGCO had the good sense to keep the brand alive and improve on it yet again. I switched to a red rotor machine this year but will certainly entertain a silver rotor next go-round! (the red one was cheap) :) |
Posted By: AndrewGubbels
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 7:15am
|
That is one thing they stressed over and over again was that GLEANER Combines are hear to stay!! The tritura is latin for Thresher. In field tests they went against a deere and case combine on the wheat run and it combined More with a cleaner grain sample. Alot less compaction and burning 20% less fuel. I would say it is an impressive machine!! Andrew ------------- Andrew Gubbels Gubbels Restoration |
Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 8:12am
|
Andy, what makes it different internally,then the 76? I see it has more concave area,Is it mostly hp? Is there any real drastic changes to the guts of the combine? IG------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 4:47pm
| Rotor and cage are 30 inches in diameter instead of 25 inches.......accelerator rolls are larger in diameter for more capacity.....cleaning fan has been changed as well (I assume larger in diameter) for more air which has been needed since 1996 with the longer sieves. I sure hope the feeding system is up to the task of delivering the crop to the new more hungry processor. |
Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 5:36pm
|
398 hp out of the small bock. I sure hope they havent brought out another N6. Wander why they didnt put the 7 cylinder in it? I still dont understand why they didnt redesign the outside of the combine to make it look more modern. I hope it eates up everything IG ------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: AllisFreak MN
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 5:42pm
|
Where's the massey decal?? ------------- '49 A-C WD, '51 A-C WD, '63 A-C D17 Series III, 1968 A-C One-Seventy, '82 A-C 6060, '75 A-C 7040, A-C #3 sickle mower, 2 A-C 701 wagons, '78 Gleaner M2 |
Posted By: Dale-OH
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 6:56pm
| The 398 HP is a bulge at 1950RPM it is rated at 370HP at 2100RPM. I dont think this engine will have any problem, we have noticed them in tractors to be very strong. I agree with Andy that they have made the changes to make this a different machine. I had the chance to talk with a couple of the dealers who first hand have seen this combine in the field and they told me it was a beast. These are actual dealers on one on one with no company people around Honest opinions. |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 7:44pm
| Hate to be the one to rain on Agcos parade here, but a larger diameter rotor makes it less efficient as a rotary machine and more of a conventional with a rotor styled thresher. This new "launch" is exactly what I figured it to be a marketing scheme to revive the gleaners name. Rotors work on the principle of centrifical force the greater the force the more capacity a machine has, a large diameter rotor has less centrifical force than a smaller rotor and if you dont believe me put a set of dice on an old 33 rpm record player , slide them to the out side of the record and the dice will ride , put them toward the center and they will fly off the record. John Deere pulled this when they brought out the 9000 series conventional combine, tell every one it has a new bigger cylinder for more capacity and run at a slower speed for a better sample what they forget to tell everyone that although the rpm is indeed slower, the tip speed is greatly increased for more damage. Unfortunatly I learned this from Allis Chalmers at the College of Knowledge, the old AC people were still around gleaner when the 9000 came in to being, and everything that they said was wrong with the bigger diameter cylinder is now exactly what agco has done, so either we are to believe that Allis Chlamers, one of the original developers of the rotor, was wrong, or the engineers from agco have forgot there own research.I hope they keep the transverse rotor around it was a great design, but I do not see this as the answer .. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 8:46pm
| I imagine the larger diameter gains them more concave distance/length from front to rear which helps with more % of seperation at the beginning instead of depending on the cage to do more %. I run 320 rpm in a lot of corn with a 25 inch diameter rotor......a 30 inch diameter rotor will need to run at 267 rpm to have equal peripheral speed (2093 FPM) which is fine and will work OK. With wider spaced rasp bar teeth and hi-wire concaves I don't ever seem to have issues with grain damage in corn/soybeans. I know what I'd like to see in the new processor....a "round-bar" concave like the Lexion has as an option. More whole cobs and less plugging with leaves and even less kernal damage....round bars....like an old corn sheller has, only closer together. |
Posted By: N6PETE
Date Posted: 12 Aug 2010 at 11:38pm
|
I see they still have those blasted reverse bars in there. Maybe with the CDF they need them but I have found they do nothing but rob horsepower and grind cob. Hope this is the beginning of Gleaners return to being a major player in the combine market although it seems that AGCO is very good at rescuing defeat from the brink of success. JMHO Pete Hinrichsen |
Posted By: AndrewGubbels
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2010 at 6:07am
|
THe combine I took photos of was a canadian special. It did not have a variable speed for the header drive and it had reverse bars along with some filler sections on the cage. As was said earlier about the capacity. THe rotor is bigger. along with the concaves bigger. From 4300 some odd inches to 6045. The engine has been used at this horsepower in the tractors actually. The dt275b they have been running very well. I tried getting some photos of the fan I could not get them to turn out clean under neath. It is alot bigger. THe angle of the blades has changed also the way it looks. The Accelerator rollers are spinning faster to help also with more product. They are bigger diameter. THey were showing some very impressive video of the combine in multiple crops harvesting at really fast rates. It seems to be feeding very well! As Dale said the people that have seen the combine in action have no complaints! I am looking forward to getting one in the field! Andrew ------------- Andrew Gubbels Gubbels Restoration |
Posted By: GS7
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2010 at 7:08am
|
Hey Guys, We're giving dealers a few days to review materials before we start posting new content. Please bare with us in the meantime. Tritura is latin for "to thresh" and is the name of the new, larger processor (Rotor, A-rolls and fan are all larger). The larger rotor actually is more efficient. We are harvesting more grain with less fuel than the R76 by a good margin. The larger rotor allows the same tip speed at lower RPMs while it also produces a better fly wheel action. This is not a marketing ploy. It is a new machine and the people that have seen it attest to that. I'll come post when we put the new content on www.gleanersuper7.com |
Posted By: gleaner1
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2010 at 7:55am
| I agree with you Kcgrain on the larger diameter rotor. I'm almost positive around the time the cdf rotor came out, Agco claimed that they were maxed out in capacity and increasing the diameter would do nothing, this was less than 10 yrs ago. you guys need to go to combineforum.com usually more gleaner info on there. hard to tell from pics but i sure hope they increased the door size near the concave, as this should have been done 20 yrs ago. |
Posted By: Byron WC in SW Wi
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2010 at 9:24am
|
AGCO orange tractors outsold red and yellow ones in greater margin than Gleaner does. AGCO had it's own dealer network where Gleaner piggy backs off from AGCO dealers. With AGCO dealers being shoved to MF do you think Gleaner will rise in popularity or MF? AGCO stated several times that the orange tractors would not go away as long as people bought them which turned out to be a lie. Do you really think that the Gleaner combine will remain as a Gleaner? CAT dealers, from what I understand, aren't giving up the Lexion combine. Eventually you'll be able tot get a Gleaner but only in MF red. On combines: How many years before the small guy can't keep his own combine? Eventually these 20-30 year old machines are going to wear out. There is no one on Earth anyone will be able to keep a Super 7 full in my neck of the woods where the average field size is under 10 acres and many of them under 3. |
Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2010 at 10:39am
|
I am with you Byron. Its a matter of time. The AGCO people are a bunch of liars. This combine is no more talked about then the: Long live the family farm was just a couple of years ago. I have quit worrying about what they are gong to do. I am switching to another color on everything we have as the time comes. I never thought I would see the day this farm didnt have orange and silver. But the working tractors are all a different color other then a 9745 that we use a little. If I could give the A85 to a Deere dealer I would,but cant even get anyone to trade for it. This new S7 now has bigger internal parts, that they sayed a few years ago wasnt possible,now they do it(they were lying then ,or there lying now). So I get the A85 which isnt that bad of combine,but you can see that isnt going to exist now.(they cant sell masseys to gleaner guys). How many people would buy a new chevy with a duramax in a 92 body with the price of all of the 2011? Not very many. They need to add new customers,at the same time keep the old ones,not run off the existing ones they have now.
IG ------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: AndrewGubbels
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2010 at 11:54am
|
I guess everyone to there own but I am excited for the new combine and very impressed with what its potential is. As an employee for an agco dealer it feels we really get alot of sh*t for things out of our hands. I try to make the best out of what we have to work with. It seems we have to work twice as hard and twice as many hours before we even get a customer to look our way just because of everyones negative attitude. I really am begining to wish every fricken tractor made was painted the same color. Andrew ------------- Andrew Gubbels Gubbels Restoration |
Posted By: Ron Eggen
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2010 at 12:47pm
| Thanks for the info Andrew ! Even though I and most of the viewers of this page don't need or can't afford a new Gleaner, we still enjoy hearing about them. Do you know if a new model will be offered by Ertl or someone else ? That would be what I am interested in and will be purchasing. Thanks ! |
Posted By: AllisFreak MN
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2010 at 4:24pm
|
You can thank AGCO for the negative attitude. ------------- '49 A-C WD, '51 A-C WD, '63 A-C D17 Series III, 1968 A-C One-Seventy, '82 A-C 6060, '75 A-C 7040, A-C #3 sickle mower, 2 A-C 701 wagons, '78 Gleaner M2 |
Posted By: Andrew(southernIL)
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2010 at 7:04pm
|
ILGLEANER how are you liking your green tractors? Do you like them better than the AGCOs you had or do all these new tractors pretty well have all the same stuff in them? You could do like some guys near here that were big time White people that had to buy a new AGCO do to no more White and had it painted the White colors so it would fit in on their farm...lol, just kidding thats a little drastic thing to do to a brand new tractor but they did it.
------------- If fishing is a sport your looking at an athlete |
Posted By: Ryan Renko
Date Posted: 13 Aug 2010 at 7:20pm
| I'm just excited to see photos finally!!! The transverse Gleaner is all a true AC fan can still cling to as theirs, so I'm hoping its a sucess!!! Ryan |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2010 at 9:44pm
| Andrew, I appreciate the photos and your dedication to your job at the dealership and the agco co, and my reply about the new and improved combine is not pointed towards you, but you have to realize when some one like me has to spend close to a 1/4 of a million on a new combine and heads we are not going to take the topic lightly. This is real money, real work that has to pay for it and as I get older I get more and more fed up with marketing genies that know nothing about a combine, never ran one never set one never PAID for one filling everybodys head with there new and improved. I appreciate the fact that that is the combine your dealership has to sell, but unfortunatly it is not the combine I have to buy. If Agco was so determined to really make this a new and improved version of the transverse rotor, they would have clean paged the design, much like Deere had with the 9000 series, NH did with the CR series. A rebadged N7 with a new engine and cab isnt new and improved. Rotors no matter whose, love HP and lots of it, the capacity of the machine is more dependant on the HP and the cleaning area than the actual threshing area, the original N7 had 270 hp but anyone that ever had one knows the power of an AC 516 was well over 300 with the p pump intercooler etc the way it was set up for that combine. Now almost 40 yrs later we have a new and improved N7 body with a 385 hp engine and a bigger tank, woopie.Marketing wanted more threshing area for the literature, so we give it a new larger rotor, the numbers are bigger so its improved. Is this any different the the constant battle between Ford Chevy and Dodge on who has the larger Diesel? Its pathetic to me that these company people really think that buyers of there products are so dumb that because chevrolet has 5hp more than a ford or 75# more payload capacity that we will buy it, and this mentality has flowed into the tractor and combine markets, if you had a gleaner and you believe agco is going to remain building a real gleaner that you will buy this new N7, and if your already switched to another brand like we have than this new N7 will mean nothing, and a bunch of great reviews at the intro means nothing either. When New Holland brought out the gemini series of tractors they had a focus group and the group told NH and its engineers that they wanted a 2 door cab, so NH has 2 doors, less than a year later CaseIH retooled the Maxxum, and took away the 2 doors, when I went to the intro of the new MX series tractors at the Case Plant in Racine you have to listen to the 1/2 hour speel on the new tractors before they take you to the plant, the "new" maxxum was in the lobby and the bus load from our dealership was getting the companys marketing blast about how great of a tractor this machine was, when they went to a Q&A session the very first question asked was why did Case take away the 2 doors, the farmers in this area really liked the 2 door cab, Cases reply was that there focus groups the famers surveyed didnt want 2 doors they only wanted one so Case took it away, I told the company guy that that was a funny answer because NH just brought out the Gemini and there farmers wanted 2 doors, so why dont you just tell us the truth that as a cost savings you elimented the second door, instead of BS about focus groups, Q&A stopped with no reply and we went to the plant, just to have the same company man give us the tour of the plant and the new MX line of tractors, when we came to cab assembly the comapny rep was telling us about this new process CaseIH had invented to bond the glass to the cab, no more rubber seals to leak over time and this new process tooks years of development and was state of the art in tractor manufacturing, I laughed and told the group a new process that Allis Chalmers had pioneered in 1982 with the intro of the 8000 almost 20 years prior, the Case guy was POed big time and another dealer that was with us said well AC was always 20 yrs ahead of everyone, needless to say the company guy was done with his BS about what Case IH had done. My point here is these companies always fill ya full of a bunch of BS about these so called new products, and I hope I am wrong , I hope the super 7 is a killer and keeps the Gleaner name alive, as a lasting legacy to Allis Chalmers inovation, but I am afraid my hunch is correct. |
Posted By: luxford
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2010 at 10:43pm
|
Personally i love the gleaner design, and i appriciate its shape - i much prefer it over the NH, JD or other Red ones.
I wish i could buy a combine here for 1/4 million US dollars? - They would need over 1000 Rotor hours on them to get down that low - try 500-700 000 if you want a new one. i like the changes, i think the gleaner rotor did need to be made bigger - it wouldnt have worried me if the machine was made wider either - already run the wheels out wider than the machine, so whats the difference.. (besides shipping of course).
i doubt if the machine needs more horsepower - i am not sure about corn - dont touch the stuff, but certainly in small grains it is more than enough - horesepower is really the limiting factor for our harvesting capacity - Certainly cleaning area is, however the Gleaners ability to remove MOG prior to hitting the shoe increases its capacity immensely. - On a good day in wheat - there is still hardly a combine around that could hold a candle to a R72. i realise you guys do mostly corn/soy so have other issues... We do mostly wheat, so that is what we want a combine to be able to handle.
The down fall for gleaner - at least in this country (Australia) has been dealerships. i spoke to a guy yesterday trading his R75 (i was thinking of buying it also) for a 9870 - the reason for swapping is not how the body looked, the cab or the capacity - but rather when you spend the money buying new and there is an issue, you want to be able to make a phone call - and have it fixed properly and fast. The local John Deere dealer can offer that service, the local AGCO one.. probably not. basically the dealer set up can not support the machines properly.. i know the gleaner is easly to work on - i run them - however everyone is busy - no one wants to be stopped fixing the machine yourself - especially if you run a few, or trucks etc also - so good dealer back up is essential, And Sadly they often fail in this area.
|
Posted By: luxford
Date Posted: 14 Aug 2010 at 10:45pm
|
sorry Horsepower is RARELY the limiting factor in our area, not really the limiting factor.. unless of course you dont have enough to carry a full box!!!
Damn Typo
|
Posted By: Matt (NEIA)
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 1:28am
|
I must say i like the looks of them, i just hope they don't do to Gleaner what they did to Agco, i can see in a few years Gleaner being painted Massey Red and named a different series of Massey Combine as a "Company Stratagy" much like the phasing out of Orange tractors was. ------------- 1955 WD-45 with factory PS |
Posted By: AllisChalmers37
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 1:47am
|
Well, as morton(pa) origionally said you notice that the red decals have replaced the orange ones that have been there since Allis-Chalmers owned Gleaner. I hate to ask a question in an answer but I noticed that the word AGCO is no where to be found on the machine. Did they just do away with the AGCO line of tractors or are they eventually going to get rid of the AGCO name completely? ------------- 1937 WC, 1950 CA, 1959 D14, 1967 190XT, 2006 Ram 3500 |
Posted By: redline
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 3:38am
------------- If it weren't for the last minute, I wouldn't get anything done! |
MI8050 wrote:Posted By: farmerleach
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 10:36am
Look at the serial number plate on the machine. The one on our Massey combine says Massey Ferguson made by AGCO. I know it doesn't say it down the side of the machine, but the name is still their.
|
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 11:15am
|
Kcgrain, what changes would you have made? Would you quit the transverse rotor or changed the cleaning system? Just curious what your limiting factors are that should be changed that the Super 7 didn't address. Would you change the cab interior. You know, shuffle the buttons or make the cab even larger? How about the styling or using plastic to make a real stylish machine? Personally I thought the unloading auger system could have been changed to that like the A series. Not the turret but the sly way they made the swivel style so much higher on the later A series. I don't know if it is as reliable as the old swivel style though. You know, and I have no proof, but I had told a few people 10 or 15 years ago about how I would make that swivel system much higher and that is exactly they way AGCO did it. Oh well. ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: redline
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 1:09pm
------------- If it weren't for the last minute, I wouldn't get anything done! |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 1:58pm
|
Here is the unloader on the A series. Scroll down to page 22 (they aren't numbered). My thoughts at the time were to eliminate the bottom auger completely and just angle the floor of the bin right with the unloader auger. It would be a one auger system. http://www.agcoiron.com/fileUpload/GL09A6_FINAL.pdf - http://www.agcoiron.com/fileUpload/GL09A6_FINAL.pdf ------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 4:09pm
|
I personaly think if they would have incorporated the new style unloader on the transverse,put on new plastic sides like all other combines on the market, give it a new look,with everything they have done on the inside. Then you have a NEW combine, this is nothing more then an UPDATE of the current model. I guess if they are going to keep with a 1992 design and price I will be interested in one.
Andrew the Deere is a nice tractor. We are also running Versy 4wds. Good thing about the deere the dealer is in town, not 50 miles away.
IG ------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: DrAllis
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 6:16pm
| Pretty difficult if not impossible to do the new style unloader and keep the same bushel size tank....the bottom end of that new unloader would be into the rear feed chain or the overall height of the machine would have to be 18 inches taller?? |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 6:46pm
| When we updated from our TR series NH to the CR we looked at the New Gleaners and some a few years old, I actually like the styling of the old N7 thought it had a functional and unique look, but than again I still like the look of the old square front chevy pick up and still think the old steiger series 3 panthers have a better look and style than the new ones. Now I cant say what the interior of the new super 7 is because I have not seen one but if the cab is like the old model its replacing the cab controls and tattle tale system is exactly like the old L2 were, just painted light grey rather than saddle tan, which works dont get me wrong but its a 1970's design. The second thing I thought needed addressing was the cylinder to concave clearance, which I was told there is a kit that can be added to make it electric from the cab, that is a dated design, our NH and the newer Deeres case Ih etc this is all done inside the cab. Stone ejection system is another sore spot, on the L2 and L3 I had if you hit a stone it kicked open a door underneath the cylinder, you than had to crawl underneath the combine, in sometimes not so nice a place and lift the door shut with your legs and take a tool to lock the latches, on the rotary you do that standing but you have to open the side panels put a special tool into a latch and swing the doors shut and lock, on the NH you lift the head to the full up position the door relatched put the head down and combine, that needs improvement on the gleaner in my opinion. The reverser much like JD and Case on the gleaner will back the slug out, but if you have ever combined weedy crops or ropey beans you know that when it backs out in a slug it feedsback in, in a slug, on the NH its hydraulic so you can back it out than turn around and feed it back to the rotors slowly and process it. The unloading system on the TR and the gleaners are very similiar and I actually like that design but on the NH the unloader can be unloaded anywhere its swing position from full in to full out, the gleaners better be all out or things break, the NH also has a higher reach than the Gleaner. The bottom line for us I am talking now, was for me to switch from a NH and go back to a Gleaner would be like going from a Lincoln town Car to a ford probe, both good cars mind you both get you from point A to B, however one is way more comfortable to operate and its hard to go from power windows and door locks to one with out, and thats what the Gleaners are. In 1985 when AC went out the N series was cutting edge, but its not 1985 any more, its a 2011 combine. My point is I guess if agco was really interested in this being a flag ship machine like it was in the past it would have addressed these issues, a more modern look sells machines, dispite the fact that I like the look of the old machine. But it would have shown the combine buyers that agco was serious about the transverse rotor, much like they did with there new and now gone orange tractor, at least it had a modern appeal and feel. A bigger diameter rotor and accelerator rolls does not constitute much of a change other than its something new to write about. And last but not least, still doing business with the dealership I worked at I do get some insight to whats going on in the Agco world and if memory serves about 5 years ago maybe more the word Agco gave to the dealer than was the transverse rotor was going out, it was being replaced with a axial model painted silver with a gleaner badge, amd as soon as inventory was depleted the transverse was gone, the A series appeared not soon after that, the transverse rotor has still stuck around, so what makes me wonder is the "new" N7 offered to keep the transverse alive, is it here to burn up what left of already made parts, is the market still strong enough to keep the transverse rotor around? Massey combine market in NA is very very small compared to the big 3 New Holland is No1 world wide Deere No 1 in NA Massey has a following over seas but very weak here, Gleaner use to be a BIG player till AC passed now has small strong spots. Why did Agco tell the dealers way back when that the transverse rotor was done? Why didnt they dedicate more money to a new modern design? I would like to believe agco that the AC rotor is here to stay, and that it is superior, ......but they still offer a silver massey with a gleaner badge, and agcos word had been less than honerable, and with dealing with large companies that change hands when they say nothing is going to change............everything is going to change, agcos position doesnt work for me personally when I have to write the check and the last CR it was $285,000 thats to much to gamble for me on past memories of a once great machine and company.I love Allis Chalmers loved there tractors still rely on them, still buy them, but agco is NOT Allis Chalmers, never will be even if they owned the name they are not AC. |
Posted By: Byron WC in SW Wi
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 7:20pm
|
Wow. Some well put well thought out responses in here. I don't know enough about the combines to make a judgment on them. I just know that you recognize a person by their fruit and it's the same with a company. AGCO's management fruit is rotten. It's really too bad. They build some decent products. I bought a rake this weekend and am getting a discbine. Both are not AGCO and will not be AGCO because they dropped orange. I like Hesston stuff and was fine with the burgundy but the red makes me queasy. If AGCO didn't drop the orange though I'd be having an all Hesston lineup. Now it'll most likely be NH and Kuhn. |
Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 7:27pm
|
Dr. Allis my A85 is probably at least 18 " taller then my R75 was and I dont think it holds anymore then my R75. They both have Hopper toppers. I understand what your saying,but the A didnt have the depth the 75 had because of the cylinder right under the hopper full length.
IG ------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: MI8050
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 7:33pm
| To say the cab on the current or even recent Gleaners is anything like an old AC cabbed Gleaner is nuts. Yes they have glass windows and are centered but have no similairty aside from that. The ones I sat in at the NFMS two winters ago were very nice and functional. It'll be twenty years before I can afford a super 7. As far as machine stying, CIH combines still look similar to where they sarted (at least the 88's). Only JD has felt the need to clean sheet redesign their machines every so often, their dealer network is what keeps selling their stuff for them. |
Posted By: ILGLEANER
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 7:47pm
|
MI8050 I am with you on the cab of the gleaners. They are nice. I set everything on the A85 from the computer screen. There is more room in the Gleaner cab then a deere. I still like the layout of the CNH cabs. I would have to disagree with you on the CIH combines they have about totally redesigned there combines over the last few years. About the only thing the same is the color of paint on there combines compared to 5 years ago on the outside look.
IG ------------- Education doesn't make you smart, it makes you educated. |
Posted By: Kcgrain
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 8:12pm
| I didnt mean the cab was the same, obviously it is different, the controls and the console is just like my original L2 and the tattletale system layout, but painted grey but they added some switches to the hydro handle |
Posted By: ScottinSWIL
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 9:46pm
| I will agree that some new styling would be nice, but let's face it, the inner improvements are more important capacity wise. I run a R75 with an 8 row head, but this super series needs to be capable of eating up 12 rows of corn at a decent pace even in higher moisture situations to be really looked at by people other than true gleaner lovers. I'm confident that the styling will come soon, but the capacity improvements are the most important part now. My neighbors CIH 8120 is an awesome looking machine with great capacity. Yes this CIH machine had many changes over the old regular 21 & 23 series. As far as the red splash, I never thought a thing about it on the last R62 we owned, but now with the loss of orange painted tractors I do have that feeling of distrust with Agco a little bit also. I'm happy with my R75 and will stick with Gleaner. They all have their good and bad. The "A" series has that new look and we can see how impressed the Gleaner faithful are with that "New Styling". Find a Deere lover that covers many acres yearly to admit how much they spend on maintaining those Green Monsters. No wonder the BTO's want to trade every year. |
Posted By: AndrewGubbels
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 10:09pm
|
we will just have to wait to get them in the field this fall and see how they perform. The combine really does look cool. Everyone has good replies. andrew ------------- Andrew Gubbels Gubbels Restoration |
Posted By: MI8050
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 11:01pm
|
Posted By: MI8050
Date Posted: 15 Aug 2010 at 11:06pm
|
Had been thinking the 5088's etc looked alot like the 2577's etc . Totally different look aren't they! I love Tractorhouse. 2577 looks alot like the heap I bought this year (1420) in alot of ways, the 5088 isn't much like it at all, I stand corrected. |
Posted By: ACD19farmboy
Date Posted: 16 Aug 2010 at 6:45pm
| HAHA we all said it!! the Orange is probly gonna go on the gleaners, and i guess this is there way of truning it to RED!!!! |
Posted By: SilverRod
Date Posted: 18 Aug 2010 at 8:20pm
| Hi I've been sitting on the sideline on this and Gleaner Talk show for several years and they are my favourite sites. I have learnt alot from some of you guys. I'm NSW Australia and have had 7040 and 4W220 and L2 and currently run a R70. Brillant Machines. I appluade the Agco gleaner guys talking on this site. Kcgrain says that these machine look old and need to be dressed up. It all works well even the unloader why complicate things for change and make them expensive to repair and maintain like JD,CIH and NH. Sure a bit of new styling would be nice but If it ain't broke don't fix ( as the saying goes). Here in Australia I feel that it is management that needs the dressing up and tweeking. There are very few good Gleaner dealers and along way in between them. Updates and information hasn't been passed on to owners and dealers. Why would a contractor run Gleaner when he can't get parts or service nearby. I import my parts from US, as here they are too dear here up to 300% than the US and sometimes no correlation with the same part. There are only small pockets of Gleaners here and shrinking. A friend has had N7,R70,R72 and R75 and looks like he will go JD or CIH as he has not got the support from management above the dealer. This is the area Agco should be concentrating on. Pound for pound you can't beat a Gleaner and I will be following the progress of the Super 7. |
Posted By: SilverRod
Date Posted: 27 Aug 2010 at 5:01pm
| Where has everyone Gone. Priced a part in Australia today $90 us .Ordered from the US $25. If Agco want to get up there get these rip offs sorted out. |
Posted By: JPG AUSTRALIA
Date Posted: 27 Aug 2010 at 7:23pm
| Totally agree silverod, hardly any agco dealers left here in WA anymore,and they dont even know what a allis tractor is if you want parts.Gleaner parts are a rip off for sure,everytime I ring for a price on something for my r62 I end up getting it elsewhere or making it becacase the price is skyhigh! |
Posted By: Rdhermann
Date Posted: 16 Jan 2011 at 8:13pm
|
Kcgrain,
What combine cab are you looking at? I will admit that the cabs was the same as the older MH style until the R72-62 was released (Cab was changed but electronic system was simmilar), then they totally redesigned the electronic system in the R75-65 series. They are nothing like the older Tattle-Tale system. The R75 was released in 2003 and the electronic system is a CANBUS system that has proven to be very reliable. You said that the Gleaner needs to be redesigned, but they can out cut and out clean the green and red combines, while maintaining the same loss levels. They somehow manage to pull all of that off and stay around $200k less than the other colors (other colors require levelers in our area, and so that pushes the cost of them over $500k). If the body style of the combine is worth giving up a combine that is more superior than the other colors while being less expensive, then you can go ahead and buy one, but to me it doesn't seem like a good idea. As far as your problems with the increased rotor size, and that somehow making the combine more of a conventional combine than a rotory, that makes no sense, at all... The tip speed will stay the same (or be increased) and have a larger concave area, where 90% of the treshing is accomplished and that equals more capacity. on top of that it will have a larger cleaning fan and another row of accelorator rolls, which will make the combine able to clean better and also increase the efficientcy of the shoe. When you combine this with improvements that Gleaner has done in the last few years (68 degree helical bar kit, shoe slope tin kit, 4-strand feed chain, and flattened 2nd floor) it makes a pretty awesome machine that I would put head-to-head with any other combine on the market. This is nothing personal against you, the engineers have put a lot of thought and time into this, and it's a pretty awesome combine. Also, to whomever said that the marketing people at AGCO know nothing about how a combine works, you need to meet Kevin Bein. He is the head of marketing for Gleaner, and he knows more about how Gleaner combines work than anybody out there, he's nothing short of a genius. Have a good day! |
Posted By: denny sd
Date Posted: 17 Jan 2011 at 1:15pm
| Andrew, thanks for the pictures and your comments. Now my opinion regarding Agco the problem is they alienated much of their agco tractor base by saying one thing and doing another. They have force closer of so many of dealerships leaving no service of there products mainly do to distance. Its seems every move they make drive more customers to other brands Now is new super series combine and future ,the thing that strikes me is with all the native signals AGCO sends who would gamble i/2 million investment on a product with ever increase distance & service problems along with that will they around in 4 years. Ill Gleaners sums it best on is 85 series can find anyone who take in trade . I know Ill gleaner will trade but you can bet he will take a bath fron what other brand he buys siimple because AGCO constantly demostrates no direction and trading dealer will go on that basis. Heck no wants to gamble trading in a product from a company that lacks direction. |