SAE 80 EP ?
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Category: Allis Chalmers
Forum Name: Farm Equipment
Forum Description: everything about Allis-Chalmers farm equipment
URL: https://www.allischalmers.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=54061
Printed Date: 19 Apr 2024 at 1:30pm
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Topic: SAE 80 EP ?
Posted By: David G.
Subject: SAE 80 EP ?
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2012 at 5:17pm
| I recently added a D19 diesel to the stable . I am going to change all of the fluids. The operators manual calls for SAE 80 EP for the transmission and final drive. Is this the same as 80w-90 gear oil? I know oil specs have changed since the early 60's and was thinking its the same but thought I would ask to be sure. Thanks in advance. |
Replies:
Posted By: Joe(TX)
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2012 at 8:27pm
|
It will work fine ------------- 1970 190XT, 1973 200, 1962 D-19 Diesel, 1979 7010, 1957 WD45, 1950 WD, 1961 D17, Speed Patrol, D14, All crop 66 big bin, 180 diesel, 1970 170 diesel, FP80 forklift. Gleaner A |
Posted By: David G.
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2012 at 8:28pm
| anybody? |
Posted By: D-17_Dave
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2012 at 8:32pm
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EP stood for Extra Pressure, hence to make sure there was still a film of oil between the gear teeth from the torque. Due to the oil chemistry we have today there are additives that eliminate this designation. Todays 80/90 weight is the replacement. ------------- Yea, I can fix that..... |
Posted By: David G.
Date Posted: 23 Jul 2012 at 8:47pm
| I would have used the 80/90 and never thought anything else about it, but today when I was at the Rural King there was a SAE 90 EP oil that said hyd/trans and said ford in parenthesis. I thought it was worth asking about . Thanks for the help. |
Posted By: BigPuma
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2017 at 7:12pm
|
Just got my hands onto my fathers D17. It rarely gets used, and will basically be a "tinker toy" for me to fix up, and rejuvenate... Getting ready to drain and replace fluids. Opinions on synthetic fluids instead of conventional? It will probably get less than a few hundred hours a year unless I roger up for the elder farmers around here. And even then it won't be many hours. |
Posted By: MACK
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2017 at 9:17pm
| Put hydraulic wet brake -821-universal hydraulic. Don't use that heavy stuff that don't get in bearings in cold weather. MACK |
Posted By: JJ_ncOhio
Date Posted: 03 Sep 2017 at 9:33pm
|
I just did this when servicing planetary finals on the rwa axle on my combine. Manufacture wanted 90ep, can't find that product anywhere. Google search says Castrol makes it; appears to be readily available in Europe, not in continental US. Ok, so what to use as a substitute? I used Scheiffer's 75w90 synthetic. I recommend you use a synthetic also. Here's the deal, 80w90 has additives. Those additives are designated on your container as API rating (GL5, GL4,....ect) API GL5 meets military spec. Each rating refers to the additives in that particular oil. Problem with additives some are corrosive, caustic, to yellow metals (brass, bronze, ect....) I can't say because I haven't had a D19 rear end apart, nor have I broken into the finals on my rear wheel assist, so I can't say that there are yellow metal shims or whatever inside the gear case. Nor do I want to find out with the expense of replacing. Part of the "engineering" in synthetic oils is uniform molecule size, as well chemical make up not needing additives. Like I was saying I went with a synthetic and feel safe with it. I saw this thread and thought I might chime in, certainly not an expert, just recently went through the same process as you. Hope this helps |
Posted By: DougS
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 6:17am
| I'd go with 75W-90 synthetic also. It will work better than the old stuff and it flows better in the extreme cold. |
Posted By: tractorhead9542
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 8:38am
|
You may run in to a leak horse. Synthetic oils will come in and clean out sludge and seals and 'relax' them. Unless overhauled with new seals, I do not recommend it. I have been in heavy equipment for 20 years and have seen this happen several times- automotive and off road ------------- The road to nowhere...leads to me |
Posted By: BigPuma
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 9:12am
|
Yes I also work heavy equipment for a municipality. The service schedule is pretty strict so we don't have too many leakers... The tractor has sat for a few years with only occasional starts. I plan on going through it this winter Also, thoughts on Lucas additives? I've had good experiences with it in the past, but it's been in the automotive side and not agricultural equipment |
Posted By: tractorhead9542
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 9:26am
|
Look I am a firm believer in synthetics. But I do not and will not run it in anything pre 1988 unless overhauled (automotive). They will leak! And I found it to be true that Engines & Transmissions designed to take straight weight oils do not like multi viscosity fluids and have found evidence with bearing failure due to oil break down and overheat. I wish not to upset anyone but I have spent many years replying to the questions and comments label and or calling the phone numbers on the back of products to receive more information. I'm kind of a dork when it comes to fluid analysis. More expensive generally doesn't mean better in fact the oil that Tractor Supply sells is the same quality as high end brands. Everybody has their own preference and 'doctored up 'mixture to feel good about, even myself. I have always felt if you need to add something to your oil to get it to run right, you are prolonging a problem. There are additives to help cool oil and add lubricity and that's great. But we all know that these machines have been in service way longer and have way more bearing wear than what a little bit is synthetic additive will help now! ------------- The road to nowhere...leads to me |
Posted By: DougS
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 11:18am
| The problem of synthetics causing leaks was solved in the 1970s. Shade tree mechanics just keep passing folklore down from generation to generation. We're not talking engine sludge in a transmission. If I have sludge in my engine I'm going to run a high detergent cleaner first, with appropriate filter changes, anyway. |
Posted By: tractorhead9542
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 11:20am
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And then you will get leaks anyway DougS ------------- The road to nowhere...leads to me |
Posted By: tractorhead9542
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 11:23am
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Who got you so accusatory and upset. Take it easy. ------------- The road to nowhere...leads to me |
Posted By: Dans 7080
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 11:38am
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Common leak problems with the synthetic oils is the use of permatex instead of a proper gasket. The synthetic oil will eat the blue goo and cause a leak. ------------- When someone tells you Nothings Impossible, Tell them to slam a revolving door |
Posted By: tractorhead9542
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 11:43am
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Very true and poor rubber parts (usually aftermarket) from overseas seem to be an issue. ------------- The road to nowhere...leads to me |
Posted By: Bill Long
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 12:13pm
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Even in the 40's and 50's they had what we called detergent oil. We found in machines that had not been recently overhauled that using detergent oil could cause leaking and oil burning. It took the crud away that kept the oil from burning or leaks. Got quite a few more hours on the engine till overhaul. If you have a unit like Big Puma's D-17 that is just used for "tinkering around" and you have no plans for an overhaul then use the non detergent oil. You will get more hours without problems. In the hydraulic compartment use non detergent 20 wt oil. Even though I have heard excellent reports on the use of the newer transhyd oils I have heard they can also cause problems with seals leaking in older units. Older seals may not be used to the chemicals in the newer oils. If you have recently overhauled the transmission or rear ends and replaced the seals use the newer oils by all means. They really are better. However, my thinking on the older non overhauled units is use the originally prescribed oils or thereabouts. Good Luck! Bill Long
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Posted By: Brian Jasper co. Ia
Date Posted: 04 Sep 2017 at 4:01pm
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Any of the RTV sealers that smell like vinegar are bad choices for any sort of automotive use. Over time they will corrode metal and are not particularly suited for petroleum oil environments. A much better choice is Motorcraft TA31. GM also uses a very similar sealer. ------------- "Any man who thinks he can be happy and prosperous by letting the government take care of him better take a closer look at the American Indian." Henry Ford |
Posted By: amx1
Date Posted: 16 Feb 2018 at 6:17pm
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Just curious, I have a 1963 D-19, the AGCO salesman sold me the GL4 (AGCO brand) multi for the power director and hydraulic , it states semi synthetic, he said it would be safe for my tractor, but I should still use the 80-90 in the final drives, , what's you opinion on that, Thank You, Pete |
Posted By: LeonR2013
Date Posted: 16 Feb 2018 at 8:22pm
| Leaks are just a downward spiral of old equipment. I suggest diapers myself. Lol |
Posted By: Lonn
Date Posted: 17 Feb 2018 at 9:59am
------------- -- --- .... .- -- -- .- -.. / .-- .- ... / .- / -- ..- .-. -.. . .-. .. -. --. / -.-. .... .. .-.. -.. / .-. .- .--. .. ... - Wink I am a Russian Bot |
MACK wrote:Posted By: WF owner
Date Posted: 17 Feb 2018 at 1:07pm
I know Mack's knowledge and reputation. If he recommends it, that's what I would (will) use!!!
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Posted By: tractorhead9542
Date Posted: 17 Feb 2018 at 8:07pm
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821 is a universal tractor hydraulic fluid. 90 weight will destroy that power director in the cold and make the tractor creep even out of gear. Most stores list what you need as tractor hydraulic fluid, TCH or THL. ------------- The road to nowhere...leads to me |
Posted By: Brian G. NY
Date Posted: 17 Feb 2018 at 8:15pm
It Depends!!
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Posted By: tractorhead9542
Date Posted: 18 Feb 2018 at 9:07pm
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Leaks are guaranteed on relaxed seals and usually in older equipment. It's not something to throw the flag up and walk away from. That's just the way it is. Fix the problem or problems and you're fine. It's just something that you have to deal with with older equipment. ------------- The road to nowhere...leads to me |