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Radiator Cap / Carb Questions

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jonny2guns4u View Drop Down
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    Posted: 16 Jul 2013 at 9:51am
 
Hello Gents,
 
I could use some help. I recently got my grandfather's tractor started again after  Restoration. I am having a few issues that hopefully some of you guys can help with.
 
First is that the old Radiator Cap is missing the gasket around the top of the cap which I believe is not letting the System pressurise. I can hear it gurgling and then when the tractor warms up I get overflow out the tube.
 
It has a 7lbs. Cap on it but am not sure this is the correct one as Stiener sells a 7lbs. and 4lbs. I looked through all my manuals and see nothing about which one to use. Logic would say 7lbs. is the correct one, but I wanted to ask you guys before I buy a new one.
 
Second and the most concerning is Carb Adjustment. The thing runs fairly well, however when I pull the Choke out slightly it smoothes and revs right up and seems to run great. I did the WD40 (Well, Carb and Choke Cleaner. Didn't want WD40 all over my fresh new paint) around the Manifold and Carb. No Air Leaks that I can detect. I've tried adjusting the Main Jet Screw in and no change, really in or out. Honestly I have read several threads on several Sites and have tried all the tactics I've seen online. Honestly I see that neither the Idle or Load screws do anything.
 
Diagnostics tells me Lean. I'm pretty sure the Carb is a MS TSX-159 and I have put a complete Rebuild Kit in it. Here is the thing that really bothers me. When taking her up to High Throttle after just a minute or so the Exhaust Pipe where it meets the Manifold gets Cherry Red! That has always meant lean to me as well. Lean is Hot right?
 
What can I do? No Fuel obstruction from the Tank to the Carb (unhooked line at the Carb, plenty of flow), Rebuild Kit and Cleaned real good during the Restoration and checked for Air Leaks. Could it still be just out of Adjustment?
 
Any Help would be great,


Edited by jonny2guns4u - 16 Jul 2013 at 9:55am
Jonny2guns4u

"I won't be wronged... I won't be insulted... I won't be layed a hand on... I don't do these things to other people and I require the same from them." -J.B.Books (AKA)John Wayne

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Steve in NJ View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Steve in NJ Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jul 2013 at 12:32pm
Definately LEAN if the manifold gets red. Sounds to me like you have some debris lodged down in the enrichment circuit and not enough fuel headin' into the engine. When you pull the choke out a fuzz, you cut back on the air into the carb which increases your fuel charge. Hence, the better running and responsiveness. When you rebuilt your carb, did you have all jets out to clean out the circuits? Also, make sure your float adjustment is correct. The M/S carbs are a little more forgiving at times, but if the float level is a tad on the low side, that will also cause a lean condition.  HTH   BTW, Nice Tractor!
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Gerald J. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jul 2013 at 12:39pm
As will a partly plugged inlet adapter screen that is often missed in a carb cleaning.

Gerald J.
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john(MI) View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote john(MI) Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jul 2013 at 1:00pm
The adjustment on the top front of the carb is for idle.  The large one on the bottom front is power.  If it runs rough at idle, adjust the top one in.  If it runs lean at throttle, adjust the bottom one out.  Adjust by turning about 1/4 turn and waiting several minutes to see the results, they won't be instantaneous.

At least that is what I just did when I rebuilt and reinstalled the carb on my 45!
2 D14's, WD45, 5020, Big 10, 612H.
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jonny2guns4u View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jonny2guns4u Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jul 2013 at 1:13pm
Originally posted by Gerald J. Gerald J. wrote:

As will a partly plugged inlet adapter screen that is often missed in a carb cleaning.

Gerald J.
 
OMG Gerald!
 
You may have something there. While looking through the Steiner Catalog I keep seeing a Brass Elbow Connector with a screen on it and often wondered, "what is that elbow with the screen on the end of it? Mine doesn't have that Part..." This is a pic before the Restoration.
 
 
I assumed on my Carb that it was just a brass elbow with a line connector on it to the sediment Bulb, which has a screen. What your saying is my Carb may have the screen too? I had that elbow off to clean it up and put new thread tape on it but maybe the screen stayed in the body of the Carb? I don't remember seeing a screen in there but maybe there was. If so, I bet that thing is all gunked up, just as the old Sediment Bulb Screen was.
 
I'll check when I get home from work and give you guys an update.
Jonny2guns4u

"I won't be wronged... I won't be insulted... I won't be layed a hand on... I don't do these things to other people and I require the same from them." -J.B.Books (AKA)John Wayne

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Stan IL&TN View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stan IL&TN Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jul 2013 at 1:28pm
I believe you can go with no pressure cap or the pressured one.  My operators book shows both but no mention of what the pressure would be.  The pressured cap will just raise the boiling point.  As for the spitting out of coolent when it's hot.  That is going to happen if you filled the radiator all the way to the top when you refilled it.  Normally you would fill it to a few inches below the neck as it will expand when hot and puke it out if filled too much.  BTDT.
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Gerald J. View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gerald J. Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jul 2013 at 3:20pm
I've seen that inlet adapter screen allow only enough gas for a tractor engine to idle for a few seconds every 15 minutes. When I took it out, my air tank was sitting at 60 psi and couldn't put air through the screen.

The screen may be on the fitting the elbow screwed into, not on the elbow. The gas line fitting usually is not threaded directly into the carburetor body but has what i call an "inlet adapter" that screws into the carburetor body and that screen is part of that inlet adapter.

Gerald J.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Chalmersbob Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 16 Jul 2013 at 9:09pm
They didn't have a filter screen on the elbow from the factory. Those are recent add-ons. LOL Bob
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jonny2guns4u Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jul 2013 at 7:24am
Okay, I think I might have found the problem but I need some expertise from you Carb guys.
 
I took my carb apart again last night to check a few things. First to make sure there wasn't a clogged screen behind the inlet elbow. Well, no screen.

The Scond was that I saw a Video on YouTube yesterday that got me thinking. It was a guy rebuilding a M/S Carb. He said to make sure you put  the Jet with the bigger hole in as the Main and the Jet with the smaller hole as the Idle. I was afraid not being a Carb Expert that I maybe had swapped them.
 
Well when I took mine apart this is what I found. Thank God I am a Pack Rat and keep everything because I had the old ones to compare against.
 
Notice the new Idle and Seat look correct. But the Old Main looks different from the new one.
 
Seeing that the tractor seems to be starving for fuel (lean) I guess I should just clean up the old Jet and put it back in? I found out last night that my Carb is NOT a TSX-159 it is actually a TSX-422. I don't know why the new kit did not have two different Jets in it other than maybe a mistake at the Factory, however I'm pretty convinced from what's happening the new Jet is not correct. The Kit came with two identical Jets in it. I now remember now when I rebuilt the Carb looking at the two new ones and thinking that there was no difference. Looking at the old ones there certainly was! The Jet hole on the old one is almost twice as big.
 
Please, Carb Experts, confirm for me that the new smaller hole Jet it NOT correct before I put this thing back together again.
 
 


Edited by jonny2guns4u - 17 Jul 2013 at 7:25am
Jonny2guns4u

"I won't be wronged... I won't be insulted... I won't be layed a hand on... I don't do these things to other people and I require the same from them." -J.B.Books (AKA)John Wayne

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Alberta Phil Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jul 2013 at 9:18am
I would put the old main jet back in and see how it runs. You can usually remove that jet if you have to without removing the carb from the manifold.

As to your rad cap, it should probably have the 4 lb cap. The earlier 4 lb. cap usually has a longer spring assembly to fit the longer radiator necks. The 7 lb cap has a shorter spring assembly and won't seat on the bottom of the filler neck to hold pressure.
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jonny2guns4u View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote jonny2guns4u Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 17 Jul 2013 at 7:41pm
Hey Guys,
 
Thanks for the help. Sure enough, I cleaned up the old Jet, reassembled the Carb, put it back on and she's running GREAT!
 
In fact I took her up and down the road several times. The Neighbor who is Baling Hay up the road stared at her each time I drove her past. Man that Persian Orange #1 really glows with the Mid-West Ohio setting sun!
 
Hope you enjoy 31 seconds of my evening's euphoria!
 
 
 
Jonny2guns4u

"I won't be wronged... I won't be insulted... I won't be layed a hand on... I don't do these things to other people and I require the same from them." -J.B.Books (AKA)John Wayne

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